A Break Down on Klobuchar's Fraud Plan, Moderate Brand

[00:00:11] Welcome to The Break Down with Brodkorb and Becky, a weekly podcast that breaks down politics, policy, and current affairs. I'm Becky Scherer. And I'm Michael Brodkorb. This week, you're stuck with just us. We are Minnesota Heavy, and we're going to start by breaking down Senator Amy Klobuchar's anti-fraud plan she released during her run for governor. We will also discuss the Minnesota House's Fraud Committee's report and how that plays into the conversation.

[00:00:34] Then we will jump into the ongoing debate of, is Amy Klobuchar a moderate, and how her possessioning in Congress does or does not play in her campaign for governor. We will then discuss the controversy surrounding the Minnesota state flag and why it seems to be such a hot topic these days. Lastly, we will break down a recent comment from President Donald Trump that we'll likely be hearing a lot of on the campaign trail this year. Thank you for joining us and enjoy the show. Kick things off, Michael. What do you know?

[00:01:02] We were off last week, not planned, but we were off last week because aside from many of my physical defects that I have, including no hair, I suffer from kidney stones. I've done everything I can in my life to try to mitigate ever getting kidney stones. Now, if you don't know what a kidney stone is, I will say this very delicately, present company, the reason why.

[00:01:25] I have been told by women that have had both kidney stones and have been pregnant at the same time that kidney stones are way more painful. I'm not saying that that's the case. What I'm just saying to you is that they really, really, really hurt. And so we were off last week because of it. Not going to get into specifics, but what I was dealing with. But just to say they really, really hurt. And I am through it now. I hope to never have a kidney stone again.

[00:01:55] I'm working with a dietician to figure out what kind of food I need to eat better to prevent them from ever happening again. I'm basically down to I can eat basically salmon and lemon juice. That's basically and drink lemon juice. That's basically my diet right now. I'm not a big drinker. I'm not a big chocolate person. I'm not a big sweets. My main drinking vice is sugar soda, which I haven't had in like 40 days. So I'm just really that's really been a big impact.

[00:02:24] Hot chocolate was one thing that I had that would be a problem for me. So I'm eating like a fancy prisoner right now. So it's basically lemon juice, a lot of citrus, a lot of salmon, chicken breast, just things like that. And drinking probably one of the most one of the most grossest things to drink, which is unsweetened cranberry juice, which tastes like dirt. And so that's what I've been up to. I'm I'm trying to be upbeat. That's why we were off last week. I apologize.

[00:02:54] Hopefully I'll have no more bouts of kidney stones or getting hit by a car, which has been reasons for us to delay podcasts. But I thank you, Becky, for your patience, your sympathy and the flexibility of doing this show a week late. Yeah, that sounds pretty awful. I didn't know that there was some like hereditary thing to that or much about it. So thank you for per usual educating me and our audience. If you don't know what kidney stones are, Google them and then understand that they really, really hurt. Yes.

[00:03:24] So thank you. How does your wife like the childbirth comparison? I don't know that she likes it. I don't think any. I was very careful of how it's done. I wouldn't make that comparison. But nurses and others that have and doctors that have aided me through this process have made that comparison. And so I'm going to play it occasionally, factfully, awfully, politically, not. But not as a matter of fact, but more as just like, hey, this is what I'm hearing on the street. But I'm glad they're over. They are debilitating.

[00:03:52] But I honestly think, I mean, I'm really, aside from it being hereditary and something that I'm going to always have to deal with, I've really narrowed down what I'm eating. And as I said, I'm eating like a fancy prisoner right now because there's just not a lot of no processed foods, no fast food, nothing. My favorite kind of soda that we've discussed before when we had our food fights, my favorite soda was caffeine-free Coke. But I've only had, I mean, I've had like a sip or two of a can.

[00:04:20] I haven't had a full can of Coke or any type of soda, no candy, no processed sugar. I mean, it's just, I'm eating again, as I said one last time, like a fancy prisoner. Well, I'm glad you're doing well. And thank you for sharing. And I send you best wishes for no more kidney stones. And enjoy this because this is one of the few times, because it's none of anybody's damn business, I discuss anything medically related to me. All right. I enjoyed. Thank you. All right.

[00:04:47] So now we're going to move into big rollout over the weekend. As everybody knows, Senator Amy Klobuchar is running for governor. And with that had her first big campaign event of the cycle. She had a press conference, pretty traditional old school rollout of her anti-fraud government accountability agenda. She did it on Sunday, May 3rd in St. Paul. It was an in-person press conference.

[00:05:12] And she simultaneously launched a detailed policy page on her website called Get Results and Make Government Accountable. Website super simple, no frills. What is your take about the event she did in person, the website and the full kind of massive proposal rollout she did? I realize why you asked me to go first a lot of times is so you can come back and swing back at me. I don't know what you mean.

[00:06:05] Exactly. I think it was a big deal. And I thought it was as good of a press conference that there has been this election cycle than we've seen. I mean, it was an A-plus press conference in terms of process, how it was rolled out, the message, how it was picked up, and then what was rolled out later in terms of bite-sized social media clips all on social media.

[00:06:28] And the manner and the tone of the press conference, I think, got picked up appropriately by a lot of people. Your take? Yeah, you know, I know Amy Klobuchar, a big fan here. But I will say, you know, when you look at this on its face, you're right. I mean, she had Andy Lugar, which I think is really, you know, big on the credibility side, especially when it comes to fraud, feeding our future, some mayors. You know, she really just went up there and tried to make it her own.

[00:06:57] I want to walk through some of the messaging we got from her. But yeah, I mean, I think it was super traditional, super no frills and just straightforward pragmatic. And I think that's who Amy Klobuchar is. And, you know, trying to show that she is ready to be the adult in the room of all this chaos, I think, I think was, yeah, a good call. No frills. What do you mean no frills? I mean, there was just, it wasn't like super, I feel like it was just very good and straightforward. She was up on stage. It wasn't like a big produced video.

[00:07:27] It wasn't all this big stuff and flashy social media. I think it was just that she stood up at a podium, presented our deal. They have a website that pointed to that's not super beautiful, new agey thing. It is just, this is a policy proposal. I'm laying out other policy proposals at the same time. And this is what you get with me. It is, I want to combat this. There is an issue and we need to move forward.

[00:07:53] And I think some of that messaging is really some of the notable stuff I want to kind of break down from this. It was a little bit of a distancing from Tim Walls with obviously not crapping all over Tim Walls. But I think there was a little bit of space put in there saying, you know, very deliberately, I am going to do things differently than Governor Walls. I don't like the status quo. I wouldn't be running for governor if I wanted things to remain the same. I'm curious your take on this and how you think this plays with the dynamics in Minnesota.

[00:08:20] And we'll kind of come back to this a little bit more in our conversation of if she's a moderate. But was it surprising or necessary for her to come out and be verbal with some of those remarks? It was not surprising and it was necessary. I think it is important for Senator Klobuchar to show that she will be her own candidate. And she's her own candidate. She's going to be her own governor. I think that she is, that is absolutely who she is.

[00:08:46] And I think it was a very strong press conference, both in terms of rollout, format, message, and what was being presented there. One of the things that I've said that we did when we've discussed fraud a lot, I, we've spoken about fraud being an issue that I think we have both said is going to be front and center in this campaign. Klobuchar could is, I think, as close as what we've seen so far to someone who wants to step into what that Joe Thompson role was.

[00:09:12] And I'm not saying that was by design, but just from my perspective, because I'm 50% of the show, I have said that I think Minnesota has needed someone who can stand up, be credible, grab the podium, speak into the microphone and speak about fraud and people trust them. I think Klobuchar did as good of a job in asserting that role. And I'm not saying that's what every voter wants, but it's certainly what I'm looking for is someone who can stand up and say, I'm in control here. This is what we're going to do and have it be credible.

[00:09:41] I thought she struck that balance well. The other thing is that this was her first press conference. And one thing that I would note is that there has Klobuchar announced and she's done the circuit. She's been doing her role as United States Senator and going out as a candidate for governor. This was her first, truly her first press conference, high expectation. I think she nailed it. It's clear to me that this was done.

[00:10:06] And I don't know this for a fact, but I just, my observation is that what she did over the last, from when she announced to when she did this press conference, she went and picked up things that she liked. And so I think that this press conference had elements of Republican ideas, Democrats ideas and her own ideas. And it was a combination of those things.

[00:10:28] I think the most important thing, and I find this interesting, the, some of the pushback again, we're hearing a lot of discussion right now amongst people saying she's Walls' third term. I would love to know if that's been polled, if Walls' third term is a bad idea, because I will repeat, no polling ever showed that he was going to lose. And so her going out there and being, number one, the candidate that the governor is supporting, but number two, showing that she's her, that she is her own person.

[00:10:56] She is willing to show her differences from Walls. I think is she's playing it the way she needs to play it. I think Republicans were hoping that there wouldn't be that type of separation. I think Senator Klobuchar is going to be authentic to who she is. She is going to be her own governor. And if she's elected, and I think what Republicans are going to see, I think for the first time, many Republicans who haven't realized how strong of a campaigner she is.

[00:11:23] She's going to be very, very forceful and strong on the campaign standpoint, both from electioneering and from a policy standpoint. And I think that this press conference showed it. Yeah, a few things I want to pick up from that. I completely agree. I think that she very carefully and methodically tried to navigate this tightrope of Governor Walls has done great things, you know, for the state, but I am not him and I'm going to do things my way.

[00:11:49] I think her statements on that is I want to have a larger conversation about how she navigates that being a Walls supporter, but, you know, differentiating similar to Republicans being a Trump supporter MAGA, but also differentiating. I think that there are two things at play here on both sides, and I don't know if we'll be able to break that all down today.

[00:12:10] But I think certainly a part of a conversation going forward because she also was a little bit stronger with some of her language saying that we need to make sure these people go to jail. I think that some of her language on that, she understands the frustration that Minnesotans have. She's been hearing a lot of the stuff that we've been seeing this last few days of some of these folks who have stolen $5 million of taxpayer dollars, getting six months, only having to repay a million dollars.

[00:12:36] I mean, some of these things that are coming out of these court cases are pretty stark. And I think that's something that is a different component that Republicans can kind of jump on of the prosecuting and the judicial problems that we also have. But to your point about the Republican reaction, I want to, the optimist in me wants to say that when the leading Republican candidate is using some language of the third Walls term in the party, I hope it's tested.

[00:13:05] I would like to think if that's what you're kind of hinging some of your key attacks on, that it is message testing, being that we're in May of an election year. So I'm going to go on the assumption that it is, which to me also feels like maybe why that was important for Klobuchar to come out and make some of the distinctions she made. But you are right. No poll showed that he was going to lose. No poll showed that we wouldn't have a third term of Trump.

[00:13:28] But I think that I expect that to be a theme here of tying Klobuchar to Tim Walls, maybe even saying that we're going to do the same with Keith Ellison, Peggy Flanagan, some of these other folks. Everybody is tied to Walls. Walls is tied to all these massive scandals. And it's the DFL one party control trifecta that got us into this situation. I think that will continue to come. But I would like to assume it's message tested. I would say this.

[00:13:54] I think that Klobuchar did a good job of establishing distance between Governor Walls and her candidacy and her proposals. I think it's going to be I think Republicans are going to have to do a lot of work to get the Walls third term to stick on Klobuchar.

[00:14:12] I do think that in regarding Lieutenant Governor Flanagan, who's running for the United States Senate, I do believe that being the lieutenant governor, I do believe that fraud is a very ripe subject to be litigated in the Senate race. And so I think of all the candidates running right now that I think are going to get kind of that can get tagged with a negative association to with Walls. I think the one that it's most likely to happen to is the lieutenant governor.

[00:14:40] Klobuchar, and I see this, I see kids posting this on social media, that Klobuchar has never had a tough opponent. I want to remind folks that in 2006, I worked on Kennedy's race, we raised more money than Klobuchar. She is an exceptionally good campaigner. And to think that she has won her races, all of her races, because she hasn't had any substantive opponents. I'm going to tell you something. Two things can exist in the same plane.

[00:15:05] Klobuchar can have won elections and couldn't can have won because she ran in a very good year against a well-funded opponent. And then simultaneously once elected to office, she could have built up a quality constituent service senatorial office and simultaneously have a very robust campaign operation. This is a United States senator who I think travels every year to all 87 counties. It takes a lot of work.

[00:15:32] And so I think it's naive for people to think that because some of her elections have been very significant victories, that's only because she has run against weaker candidates. It could also be because she is one hell of a campaigner and one hell of an elected official who sets a very high standard for herself and wants to work very hard.

[00:15:56] Some might say she has a very high standards for her staff that include throwing combs at them or forks or whatever the good old story is. So I don't know that any of that's going to come back out because it's kind of already been litigated. But, you know, she's got she's got some skeletons there. So we'll see. We'll see. I do want to just two more comments about kind of her messaging there that she did leaned heavily into her prosecutor background. I think that this was a really good angle for her.

[00:16:24] She kind of, you know, framed it as about the law enforcement accountability side rather than strictly government. Talked about that she knows how to investigate crime. And I think that's something that I could see playing very well, especially with some of those more moderate independent voters. And then lastly, she talked about the moral and competency issue here. She talked about not only is this a failure, but it's a failure because these programs are meant to help people. And I think this is the pulling at the heartstrings that Democrats are so successful at.

[00:16:54] That not arguing that government should shrink because of something like this, but that it needs to work better. Because these funds for vulnerable individuals, kids, whatever fund we're talking about need to work properly for these programs that they're for these people that they're supposed to serve. And kind of hand in hand, we also this week had the Republican House Committee fraud report that came out. It is a lot of the same things from Klobuchar's plan, as my reading of it.

[00:17:21] Talks a lot about the competency, how this is the breadth and depth of fraud in Minnesota is much worse than anybody thought possible. Stretches along across multiple agencies. And so, you know, we know that Democrats in Minnesota in particular, between what's going on at the state capitol or the national Trump world, competency is a big, big thing. And so that's, you know, coming out there.

[00:17:45] But is my question to you is, do you think that through reports like this, through messaging, Republicans are going to be able to capitalize on the fact that because of this issue, it's evidence that Democrats cannot govern competently? So here's how I would answer that. Just again, lay the groundwork. We've discussed fraud being a key issue. I read the 84, I think it's 84 pages. Here's how I would contrast the two. First of all, just for a second, let's go through a little bit.

[00:18:14] I think the three kind of fraud documents that are out there, you have the Klobuchar's report or Klobuchar's plan, Damus' plan, and then the OIG. Now, give credit to Damus, Speaker Damus, for setting up the fraud committee. And so that is a committee that we've had the chair on. We have been very complimentary of the fraud committee, their work, and including we had Senator Heather Gustafson on talking about the Office of Inspector General, which passed this past week.

[00:18:43] And now it's going to become law, which I think Klobuchar's plan, Damus' plan, and the House Fraud Committee report all intersect over we need an Office of Inspector General. So that's good. The question that I would, how I would answer this is that I think the fraud report is detailed. It's precise. It goes through kind of the history of where things have gone, who's to blame. They have a number of recommendations.

[00:19:09] My take is the public has an attention span of 140 characters. And so how do you take a thoughtful, detailed report and then turn it into something that permeates through? I keep going back to something, and push back if you think I'm wrong. I keep going back to the fraud problem is so complicated and it's so large that the public has a problem, I think, digesting the size and scope of what it is and where it all goes.

[00:19:38] And so where I think the fraud, where I think the fraud issue in the campaign becomes it starts to break too and people start to get more traction with it is when they go out and have and discuss things and have plans to deal with it. And so it's great that the Fraud Committee put out this report. It's detailed. It's substantive. But I'm a nerd, not as much of a nerd as you are, but I'm a nerd. So I'm going to read it because I know we were going to discuss it. There is a lot there.

[00:20:06] So my question is, and going back to and what's framing this entire discussion is something that you said. You have said Republicans win by doing a better job telling stories. This is a long report that tells a story. And my argument or what I'll present back to you is the person who can go out and tell the easiest fraud story and have folks understand it consistently with repetition is going to start picking up some people. And I think Klobuchar did a good job doing that.

[00:20:35] This report was discussed in a committee, posted online. There are members of the DFL committee, members of Democrats who are on the committee have concerns about this report. And so I think it's a great report. But how do you get in? And what I'm talking about here is, again, the I love the massive document. It's exactly. But how do you take that massive document, Becky, break it down into nuggets and then go out and message on that?

[00:21:04] That's where I struggle on, because I think that the of all the reports or plans that have been issued, the committee's report is the most detailed in terms of describing how we got here. But the problem is you don't vote in an election cycle on a report. It's candidates that are on the ballot. And so my issue, huge compliments the committee for their work. I will say I want to put a marker down.

[00:21:30] Whoever wins control of the House of Representatives next cycle, I certainly hope this committee exists because I think this committee needs to exist because there's going to be more work to do. Because I don't think that I don't think an election cycle is going to fix everything. But I just wonder how this plan competes with the attention span of voters and how it gets out there. Does that make sense? Yeah. And I was from my perspective, I think that somebody like the speaker, Lisa Daymyth, could use something like this just as a reference point,

[00:21:59] like going out, pitching her deal and saying, but the report showed. And just using it as kind of something to point back to is to be able to say the report showed, you know, like this 84-page report from the hearings makes it clear it wasn't isolated actors. The report shows that whistleblowers were part of the issue. The report shows that more barriers need to come back in place.

[00:22:21] So I think that she can continue to or any Republican governor candidate can continue to move forward with their plans and their thoughts on what needs to be happened and what needs to happen moving forward. And just kind of using that as like a footnote, because you're right. I mean, it's nobody else. No typical voter is going to consume anything of that. Barely can, you know, barely, you know, if we can get them to read a news article or watch a press conference, it's impressive.

[00:22:48] So, you know, you just need to make sure that using that as nuggets. And I think that that is something that I would expect for, you know, when they're taking questions from in a debate or from reporters of where did that come from? How do you know that kind of just that reference point to give a little credibility back to it? When we just, when we were texting last night, kind of planning the show, I'm like, I bet she reads it. So that's why I stayed up and read it because I don't, I mean, you always out nerd me on these, these shows on our podcast episodes.

[00:23:16] But I went through and read it and yeah. So, but we're not average voters. And so, you know, we want to, we obviously want to be informed when we're discussing subjects. The one thing I will say that about Damath that is unique is she has a running mate, Ryan Wilson. We've been heavily complimentary of that selection. I stand by our compliments. She has designated him as fraud czar.

[00:23:39] And what's interesting about that is while Klobuchar had a bank of people, Andy Lugar being one of them who did a lot of the prosecutions. I think, and I think it's going to be interesting to see how having a candidate for governor designate a qualified, competent running mate to kind of be the fraud czar, how that will work with voters. I think that there's an accountability there. And again, as someone who has consistently said that I think Joe Thompson did a good job of stepping out there.

[00:24:07] If Wilson can do that with Damath and they can piggyback off that report, that's will be helpful to them. I think what Klobuchar did is her report or her plan, I think is more substantive than Damath's plan. But if Damath brings in the committee's report and adopts it and works it in, now you're having a discussion about some pretty detailed plans.

[00:24:30] The one thing I will say, and this is just kind of my analysis point, is that I think the Republican plan, and I think that this is important. I think the Republican plans are really pointing out how we got here more. And I think Klobuchar's plan is focusing on how we fix where we're at. That's a matter for the voters to litigate. I see benefits in both.

[00:24:56] I just think that in terms of the candidate running for office who kind of asserted themselves on the fraud, right now, I think Klobuchar did a really effective job. So do you think that with Klobuchar, you know, almost, what, 10 days, a full week, 10 days before this committee report came out, Klobuchar did her rollout. Do you think she kind of took the wind out of the sails of what the Republicans were working on this massive document and all of this stuff? Because some of her points are what Republicans are pitching.

[00:25:26] It's a really good question. Very, very good question. Here's what I think. I think that Klobuchar, since she got in the race, Klobuchar has had little or no pressure applied to her since she got in the race, not by any of the campaigns, not by the party. And so I think that carved out a space for her to work and absorb what was going on. And I think that she picked up things. I think that Republicans have not been shy about going on social media or in press conferences or at the legislature.

[00:25:55] Those are public committee hearings. And so I think she did present a plan that had Republican ideas, Democratic ideas, meaning from Democratic, and then her own ideas. And so, yeah, I think she did take a lot of wind out of their sails. If Republicans thought that she wasn't going to run and directly address fraud, they were mistaken. If they also thought that Senator Klobuchar was not going to be comfortable distancing herself from Governor Walz, they were mistaken.

[00:26:24] And so what the reality is, is that I think in this particular context, she's just playing, she's playing at a higher level. And again, I think fraud is not going away. That's why I think, I think it's an issue that I am very interested in covering. And I'm going to say it again. I think that fraud committee should exist. Even now that we have an office of inspector general, I still think that fraud committee should exist. I love it. I agree. One last question before we move on.

[00:26:50] Do you think that this, I want to have a larger conversation about Klobuchar and whether or not where we think she stands on the spectrum of moderate left, right center, all of that. But for this, for fraud and its implications down ballot for the legislative, legislative races, do you think this allows, do you think it gives a little bit of cover to some of those Democrats,

[00:27:12] either incumbents running for reelection or the candidates at Minnesota legislature, by being able to also maybe piggyback off of Klobuchar's kind of distance from Walz and this issue? Do you think that they're going to be able to say things were done, you know, Walz addressed it, but now we're going to have Senator Klobuchar. This is a major priority. Do you think it gives them cover at all? Because she is distancing to herself and being so out front when it comes to fraud, something that might have been on voters' minds as they're voting for statehouse and state rep. That's a really good question.

[00:27:42] One of the things that we've discussed, Becky, and chime in if I'm wrong, and please rebut me, but I think we have said that even though we have looked at data points and polling and stuff, and there was no poll that showed that Walz was losing in any statewide race, I think we thought the race would be closer, particularly down ballot. That if he was on the top of the ticket, there would be, I think, some more electoral opportunities down ballot.

[00:28:06] I think by him not running creates more that gives the Democrats, I think, a better chance to run the table. Now with Senator Klobuchar coming out with her plan and kind of making it safe within the election cycle amongst Democrats to draw some contrast with Governor Walz, I think that helps Democrats out. They at least have an option.

[00:28:29] It's one thing if there's someone at the top of the ticket who's dragging everyone down and everyone has to go down with the ship. But when you have someone at the top of the ticket who is willing to set the tone and say, it's okay to disagree with the governor who's not running for re-election, and we need to focus on winning our races, I think that gives them some space. Your take? I completely agree.

[00:28:51] I think it allows them to walk that line a little bit by, you know, not having to diss anything of Governor Walz, but just simply say, you know, we're going to have a new captain of the ship, you know, going forward. And this is something that this is why you need to elect us to work with Senator Klobuchar or Governor Klobuchar to do this. I think it's something that I think could have a potential benefit for them. Absolutely. Good question. Very good question.

[00:29:17] Moving into keeping our conversation about Klobuchar, but moving into I'm really excited for this conversation because I feel like we might have differing of opinions a little bit on some of this. The overall conversation that we hear all the time here in Minnesota is, is Amy Klobuchar a moderate? And there was a Star Tribune article, Klobuchar pitches moderation in governor's race, rebuffs redistricting push for Minnesota. And I'll come in back to some of the policy a little bit.

[00:29:45] But we know very well that in her time in Congress, she's kind of always been that Midwestern moderate, yet a reliable vote for Democrats. And something that I think is going to be interesting as we really get into election season, because being one of 100 is very different than being one of one. And I think it allows her to be able to play that role a little bit differently than a governorship is or how a governor acts. So I'm interested.

[00:30:12] Do you want to start with your take just on the question on its face or do you want to go into it? How will you go first this time? I think that she likes to play the moderate. I don't think that she necessarily is a moderate. I think she's really good messaging. I think that when she is in office as a governor, that Senator, governor, if she is elected, Amy Klobuchar is going to show, just like we saw from Tim Walls, that they like to say that they're a moderate. Play that on the on TV and on the campaign trail.

[00:30:38] But when it comes to policy decisions, I don't see that moderate stance. I don't think she is as progressive or will go as far as Governor Walls, but I don't think that she is a moderate. Your take? I think that there's two ways to answer this question. You can look at it from a metric standpoint. You could look at it from a data standpoint. You could figure out how many times Senator Klobuchar has voted with what would be defined as the progressive left versus how she votes in other ways. So there's that number you could come up with.

[00:31:07] We could quantify this in some way based on some conservative, progressive, liberal scale. But I think elections come down a lot to how people feel. And I think Senator Klobuchar has established a brand as being a centrist, as being a moderate. Now, again, that can be frustrating because, look, let's go back to Walls for a second. When we talked, when we were talking about Walls' journey and how he was a member of Congress in the first congressional district,

[00:31:36] how he came into that district versus how he left was entirely different. And I think we discussed on episodes years ago about how his selection of Lieutenant Governor, then Representative Peggy Flanagan, was to help boost his bona fides amongst the progressives, to help boost his progressive credentials. Once in office, we, and I think I said this too, never believed, I don't think there's really much of an example of Walls,

[00:32:04] aside from maybe he vetoed Uber-Lift bill, I think, in Minneapolis, but there wasn't much really on the progressive scale, on the progressive kind of measuring stick that he didn't go along with. And so I think Klobuchar has, again, we can figure out, and I think we should. I think we should look at the data and look at some of those vote scores. But I think most people and how they view Klobuchar are going to say she is more of a moderate.

[00:32:30] She is more of a centrist on the Democratic side. And I think that that is really fascinating. I think that she has carved out that type of brand about her. And I think this fraud, leading with this fraud press conference, how she did, I also think cemented that. That is a pitch right over the plate. That is where voters are on a number of issues, like-minded Republicans, Independents, and Democrats leading on that issue.

[00:32:58] There are a number of issues on the progressive side that she could be leading with right now, talking about some of these. I don't think she is. And that doesn't mean she doesn't vote that way. That doesn't mean she doesn't support those causes. But I got to tell you, trying to re- She's been in office since 2007. And so almost 30 years. If she wins, almost 20 years.

[00:33:23] And so when she gets into office, inaugurated, if she wins in 2027, that's a 20-year record. Then I bet you, if we looked at the data, she would have a lot of progressive votes. We think about what tripped up her presidential race, though. She was- Her presidential race was tripped up a bit because of her prosecutorial record. And she ran into some progressive resistance inside that field when she was running for president.

[00:33:53] And so I don't think that she's the type of maybe what Republicans would define as moderate or centrist, many of them. But I think to Independents and Democrats, I think she is in that lane. And I think that's the challenge. Is that fair? That's very fair.

[00:34:10] I also think that it's something that had, depending on the funding of Republican, whoever becomes the nominee here in Minnesota, if the RGA gets in, there certainly could be money spent on attacking her, proving her to the left, right? I mean, I'm going to come through some of these votes and policy stances. But I read somewhere the line that no politician in America has benefited more from the phrase, well, she seems reasonable.

[00:34:36] And I think that's exactly where she is, is she kind of just gives people kind of a warm and fuzzy. She's competent. She's straightforward. She doesn't buy into all of the partisan drama and flamethrowing at times that we're, you know, the average voter just rolls their eyes at and is so sick of. I think she just kind of comes in like the adult in the room. And, you know, looking at some of how she's run in the past is she doesn't really do the label thing as much, right? Like I'm a progressive. I'm a moderate.

[00:35:05] It's I solve problems. This is how I am going to get things done and pragmatism over pipe dreams. And I think that's kind of the way that folks looking at her on its face, I think, which a lot of voters do, right? A lot of voters don't aren't going to dig deep into the votes. I think when that comes to it, the independent swing voters certainly, I think, could buy that, especially if there's not money, mailers, ads to tell you otherwise. But I will tell you otherwise. You can tell us otherwise. Go ahead.

[00:35:33] So first, let's walk through a couple of these policy stances or votes that do make her seem moderate. The first being kind of this article, the Start Review put out was her opposition to aggressive mid-decade redistricting. This is something that she declined to embrace, Walls' pitch on this. We're seeing this more and more. Republicans are doing it. Democrats are doing it. The tit for tat. And who started what? And chicken or the egg. Who came first? It's a whole big thing.

[00:36:00] Do you think that this is a principled approach for her or just simply knowing that in a quote-unquote purple state like Minnesota, partisan gerrymandering is just not going to be something to get behind? I think it's principled. I like it. I think that was a principled position that she took. And I think that that shows. I think you said it very well. The adult in the room. I think that was an adult in the room type statement. Perfect. Another one is obviously her bipartisan brand that she's had in Congress.

[00:36:30] She is kind of one of the members that has very regularly worked across the aisle. She has examples of infrastructure, agriculture, antitrust, veterans issues, opioid legislation. And that's kind of what she's always stood on is I can work with Republicans. I think that, again, that independent middle lane, there's certainly a desire for that. Healthcare is something that I think she can work for her and against her, right? She was against Medicare for all, but she was a big backer of Obamacare.

[00:36:59] So, you know, who knows how that's kind of going to play into everything? She repealed the medical device tax, huge in Minnesota, big thing. Republican, you know, members of Congress were big backers on that. And then, again, the criminal justice prosecuting side of things that hurt her in the presidential race but has the potential to benefit her here. Because, again, the anti-fraud stuff, what she's bringing in, the prosecution, jail enforcement, oversight, there is a big, big desire for that.

[00:37:27] I think across the board, as we've talked a lot about the distrust in our governments, I think that her background kind of brings in a little bit legitimacy and trust that people want to grab onto. All right. And policy stances that make her seem more liberal or progressive. Obviously, she's very strong in abortions rights, not necessarily something that's a liberal progressive these days, but there's certainly a Republican side of that that she's too far with that. I think climate and environmental policy, as I'm very interested to see how she's going to navigate this.

[00:37:56] I think it's a big thing with Minnesota progressives. She has supported biofuels and some energy infrastructure here in the state, but she also has supported a lot of the climate action, large Biden climate spending bills. Voter rights is one that she's also been very much for. I don't like to think of this more as a liberal progressive things because I also stand for voting rights, but I know that this doesn't necessarily align with some of the reforms or stances of Republicans in the state.

[00:38:24] And then Democrat judicial nominees. I think I read somewhere that in addition to that, she's, you know, votes with Democrats in Congress 90 percent of the time. Does that make her a moderate? Who knows? But she has spent 20 years really working out this lane. I also read somewhere Amy Klobuchar campaigns like Susan Collins and votes like Chuck Schumer. I love that. And my favorite. It's really nerdy. My favorite fence sitting part of her is when she was running for president and was asked what state fair is the best. And because it was before Iowa, she said Iowa and Minnesota are tied.

[00:38:54] She can't pick. And it's like, ma'am, you are from Minnesota. We have the best. You can't sit on that fence forever. I hope that is a key question that is asked of her of reporters and debates. Choose one. And if you don't choose Minnesota, get the F out of here. Jeez. Keep going. I just threw a lot at you. Anything of that that stands out to you of making her an actual moderate or making her more progressive than she tries to portray herself?

[00:39:20] I think that I would rather, look, these are partisan offices and they are, we are such a tribalism in politics. The concept of a centrist, like a voting centrist, functionally does not exist. And that's not on either side. I wouldn't describe anyone, I'm going to be very precise about that, as a voting centrist.

[00:39:42] There is not someone, just because of the hyper-partisanship of politics these days, I don't think that exists on the Republican side, nor do I think it votes on the Democratic, exists on the Democratic side. I would love for that to be the case. The question is, do I think that Klobuchar's brand is, do I think she's the adult in the room? Do I think that she is perceived as reasonable in that sense? Yes. Of course I think she did.

[00:40:08] I think she's going to be a different type of United States senator in office than Angie Craig or Peggy Flanagan if the Democrat were to win. I think she'll be a different governor than Governor Walz will be. One of the things I will say, I think has always been interesting about Senator Klobuchar, has been the fact that the business community in Minnesota is very much thinks that this is someone that they can approach and they can talk to.

[00:40:37] That's the point I would say about Senator Klobuchar, is I think that there's an approachability with her that I think really factors in to how people view her as. If you follow her on social media, look at her account in comparison to other people's accounts, other partisans that exist. She presents herself on social media. And sadly, how people are on social media is sometimes where we first see them.

[00:41:05] And how she presents herself on social media, how she portrays herself in discussions. I think that is where I think she is a moderate, where she is a centrist and where she's approachable. Because again, I will accept the premise because I think it really would be fast. First of all, Peggy, I think you've done a fantastic job in laying out this script once again. I mean, every week they just get, but this is a fantastic discussion.

[00:41:33] I think what we, I think it would be very fascinating for our listeners to do would be to break down on some scorecards. Look at where people are at because do a Q&A back for it, because I'd be curious where her votes are. And I think what it should, in my head, it shows it's that in caucus dynamics and what I mean that exists at the Minnesota legislature. And let's go up to Congress, both the House and the Senate in Congress. There are partisan caucuses that people are members of.

[00:42:00] And while there are independents in the U.S. Senate, it's not as if they're voting 50% with one side and 50% of the other. They are, they're generally connected to someone. And so in this day and age, in this hyper-partisan political time, the opportunity for centrists to meet. And so I wouldn't be surprised if Senator Klobuchar's votes would be much more on the progressive side than I think most people understand or most people would accept. But it's her persona. And it's how she comes across.

[00:42:30] And their willingness to have conversations and to solve problems and be an adult in the room. I guess for the first time, I think I'm coming to the realization as to how you frame this out, that an adult in the room and a problem solver to me, I think for the first time means in some ways they have to be a centrist. They have to be occupied by that. They have to have the ability to talk to both sides.

[00:42:52] And that's where I think her brand is so successful that I think if this election cycle is on whether Senator Klobuchar is a moderate or not, I think in many ways, I think she's already won the debate. Because I think there's going to be a body of evidence that's going to show that she can work with both sides. I honestly don't think there's going to be much shortage of examples in this cycle of people willing to say, I'm a Republican or I'm an Independent.

[00:43:20] And I think Senator Klobuchar has been great to work with. Because I do think, as you've said again, she's willing to solve the problems. And that's the challenge, I think. And I think that's reflected in the polls. And I think you've, I would say to you, because you've worked for a member of Congress, you've had one of those high profile jobs. Help me understand there is a constituent service aspect of this.

[00:43:46] So help me understand and help our listeners understand from your perspective how someone can have maybe a more conservative voting record or a more progressive voting record, as I think we should discuss. But yet their persona and how they come across makes their public political ideology, meaning kind of that superficial non-data standpoint. How can that change from their voting pattern?

[00:44:11] I think, and I'm going to let you answer, but I think it comes from good customer service, how you message online, and how you portray yourself. But I'd love to hear your perspective on that. No, I mean, I think you're exactly right. You know, when I worked in, in Washington, I worked in Tom Emmer's office for three years, and very often the delegation does things together. They do press releases together. They do events together. Hot dish. What was that? Hot dish. Hot dish competition was always the best.

[00:44:40] And, and we give a lot of flack to Klobuchar about how, you know, her treatment of staff and the rumors about that. But she demanded greatness, and her staff was everywhere and on top of everything. I mean, if an airport in Emmer's district got funding, you know, she would want to lead, you know, she, her staff was reaching out, leading a joint press release from Emmer, Klobuchar, and Smith to applaud these funds.

[00:45:04] You know, there were different things that she, on the constituent services, making sure that she was working with the Republicans and Democrats in Congress from Minnesota, educating voters, educating the media, you know, just really giving so much information about the good things that the work in Washington is bringing back to Minnesota. And I think that's something, you know, she was always at the Feeding Our Troops events. She was at labor events. I mean, I think that's where she showed up and she was responsive.

[00:45:33] And I mean, it's like those ads you see that, like, showing up matters when you see the little kid up on stage looking for his mom in the audience and you see the smile when she recognized. Having that recognition from your senator who is so busy, who is, but she is everywhere. I think that people recognize that when they see these things in their communities, these money being brought home, a new bridge, a great event, and that she does that without it having to be, you know, a protest from the environmentalists.

[00:46:00] Or, you know, a sit-in on the Capitol lawn or anything that is super partisan and super flashy. You know, she just does the work. And I think that's where a lot of people, again, just look at her and say, she can do this job. And I think that's a hard thing for Republicans to combat because she has such a long history of being that person.

[00:46:23] And again, without the money to spend behind pointing out some of these specific progressive bills that she sponsored or not, it's hard to point across when that persona, as you laid out, is just what people know and feel and see. I think of your old boss, who we all still work for, Congressman Tom Emmer. When I hear people bring up Tom Emmer's name to me, Congressman Emmer's name to me, and they're like, God, he's online. He's so mean. He's so harsh. I think back to when I first met him.

[00:46:53] I think to the campaign for governor. I think about the interactions that we've had, flying on the plane with him. I just think he's like, just gregarious and he's a fun guy to be around. And so I don't see him, even though I know that he's the House majority whip, I always, in my head, think of Tom Emmer as like, I'd vote for that guy for governor in a second. And there are people that I know who think he's one step away from the Antichrist. And I don't see him that way.

[00:47:20] And I just, in my head, no matter what Tom Emmer tweets, no matter what he says, no matter how he acts, I will always think of them as like the hockey dad, the good dad, working the parades, fun, gregarious guy, telling jokes. The guy who, when I was in the airport with my family, came up and could not have been nicer. Went to Washington, D.C., his staff was great. I will always think of them that way. And so I think that there's a public persona and a private way.

[00:47:49] And I would imagine, I don't want to put you on the spot, but you would think the same way about Emmer, just in positive ways. And so that's the thing. It's hard for people to wrap their head around. I think respectfully that there are politicians in this state who people take a very hard partisan tone to when, I'll give you a perfect example. Christian Bradfin said, that was one of the most amazing conversations we've had with someone. Now, I know that there are people down in the first who think that he is at the right side of Donald Trump.

[00:48:18] All I can tell you is everything I've heard about him and our conversation with him, he's a very laid back guy, fun to talk to him. I think the same goes on a little bit. It's going to be going on with Senator Klobuchar. There are people who have had experiences with her. You know, she gets a lot of flack on the progressive left. There's been protests that have gone on and stuff like that. So that's what I would say. You've brought this up a couple points and I want to answer this directly.

[00:48:44] Yes, there have been some commentaries about her staff treatment and that is fair for the voters to litigate. The one thing that I would say, and I'm not trying to diminish it in any way at all, but I think state government right now could use a shakeup and a little bit of a new sheriff in charge. And I think that the more Senator Klobuchar gets out there and is the grown up in the room to steal how you described it and is a problem solver, I think that's good. And I think this is going to be a hell of an election cycle.

[00:49:13] And between Klobuchar's plan, Amos' plan, Wilson as the fraud czar, I think we're going to have a substantive debate. But that's my take. But I think you've laid this out great. To one last comment and one last question, I think, as you mentioned, kind of the public versus private perception wearing my Republican hat, I would certainly say that I think that this is also where Republicans like myself have a little bit of frustration.

[00:49:37] By Klobuchar largely getting a decent pass from the Minnesota media and national media on some of her accolades to the left. But that's a conversation for another day. The last question I have for you when it comes to this topic, and we can certainly get into this more next week when we talk about the upcoming conventions. How do you think this race could be impacted by the moderate slash liberal debate we see going on within the U.S. Senate race with Klobuchar and Flanagan?

[00:50:06] And do you think I've heard that there are some folks working for a no endorsement of Klobuchar at that because they feel like she's handpicked? She's not the grassroots choice. How do you think that race, do you think that that race, the Flanagan-Kraig race and, you know, Flanagan and progressives going by, Craig is too moderate. Will that carry over and impact negatively Klobuchar's race at all? It could. Absolutely. It's a great question. Great insight.

[00:50:32] I think what I would say to you, the arrival of ICE in Minnesota fundamentally changed the political landscape in this state. Fundamentally changed the political landscape in this state. And I think that has really shown itself in the U.S. Senate race on the DFL side. And so if there is an organizing effort at the convention where I could absolutely see that.

[00:50:53] One of the things that I know from covering media reports and just from other sources is there have been some protests at Klobuchar's office from the progressive left about a number of issues. And so ultimately, though, I'll tell you something. What happens if Senator Klobuchar goes to the convention and there is a vocal progressive side that is opposed to her? You know what that does? That pushes her more to it. That makes her more of a centrist. It gives her a talking point.

[00:51:19] And it gives her an ability to say that I think the convention will leave united in many ways because the Democrats are better at having contested conventions. But I could make the case that if Senator Klobuchar had some resistance on the left of the convention, all that does is have her come out of that convention more of being a centrist and a moderate. And it helps her out.

[00:51:42] I think we can certainly dive into that a little bit more as we get closer to the conventions because this is our Super Bowl is just like two, three weeks away here. Very excited for both conventions. But want to move into next topic. All right. The state flag. As most people remember, we got a new state flag. There is still, despite that being adopted in 2024, still a lot of pushback on that.

[00:52:07] There are, according to reports, nearly 100 local governments are either flying the old flag, refusing to switch, or formally voting to reject the new flag. Some of those cities include Elk River, Invo Grove Heights, Ambrota, Champlin, Plainview. And currently, the Wyoming City Council and Itascus County Board are among local governments still discussing whether to fly the official or old flag. Do you think that it would, did you expect, was it on your bingo card for two years later to still be discussing this?

[00:52:37] Here's what I'd like to discuss about this. First of all, I didn't like the old flag once, first of all, I didn't like the old flag. I think we had a show, we had more than one show about this. And the aesthetics of the old flag, it was a bit dated, okay? I'm not, I'm still not a fan of the new flag. I don't think it is some grand conspiracy. I don't think it was designed to look like the flag of Somalia or some other type of, I don't think there's secret messages in it. I'm just not a big fan of how it looks. It may grow in me at some point. I don't know.

[00:53:06] What I find interesting is this debate going up. And so I'm going to wear a couple hats in this and please allow me some rope to potentially hang myself or hang a flag on, on this. But I understand the debate. I mean, I understand the resistance to the new flag.

[00:53:26] As much as I think that there was a process by which it was done, I think that there are still questions about this new flag. I ultimately think, and this is going to be a bit pointed, that it is a distraction right now for Republicans. Because I see more Republicans talking about coming up with the messaging more on what we should do with the flag than we are with gas prices.

[00:53:53] And so again, my concern is, yeah, can Republicans walk and chew gum at the same time? And if they were, is all this energy we're putting into a flag debate, taking away from Republicans talking about issues that are going to be meaningful. And I will tell you, I think a lot more people are going to be voting on what gas prices are in the fall than on where the state flag is going. But I wanted to start with that. Again, not a fan of the old flag, not a fan of the new flag.

[00:54:22] It is gaining some momentum, this opposition to it. But what I would like to see is Republicans having more discussions on how they're going to lower gas prices than being focused on trying to go back to an old flag. That's part of my answer. Your take. I agree. I think it's silly. I'm with you. I don't love it. I didn't love the old one.

[00:54:42] I think it's really silly that this is like now this hot topic debate of like rural versus twin cities and left versus right and what underlying implications that this flag had and, you know, that we hate it just because it was a DFL. You know, nobody asked the voters. I mean, it's just like get off my lawn a little bit. Right. I just there are so many other things to focus on. This is obviously something that gets clicks.

[00:55:09] So it's kind of that cyclical, like we keep talking about it because it's something that fires up a lot of folks that maybe don't talk about gas prices or don't, you know, read the articles about inflation and stuff of that sort. I think there's a total audience for this that is clicking on these articles that is keeping this in front of people. We have the DFL who introduced legislation that would financially penalize cities and counties for refusing to fly the flag.

[00:55:35] That chief author, Rep Freiberg at DFL from Golden Valley, said that he's not intended to be serious and doesn't want the bill to pass. He just wanted to raise awareness, which was just like a thumb in the eye of the debate as a whole. It's just saying, well, we want to do this, which just fires up the right even more saying. Epic trolling. They want to mandate, you know, you know, Republicans anti-mandate. So anytime a Democrat comes out and says, we're going to have a mandate that you have to do this or you have to pay money into the state government.

[00:56:05] I mean, the Republicans heads are exploding, right? You're forcing them to do something and going to take more of their hard earned money if they don't. It's just like it was literally I feel like there was a bet here and somebody was like, I dare you to do this. Right. It's just silly to me. And it's not surprising that it's staying out there, but it's silly. It is silly. A couple of points I want to raise.

[00:56:27] I've traveled the state in the last month or so with some family and noticed that the old flag is flying in a number of places. And then I want to share a fun story. A couple nights ago, a couple weeks ago, I think around 10 days ago, the Hastings City Council had a debate on the state flag. I gathered my family came down and we watched the debate from the Hastings City Council. It was the type of nerdom that I think only might appear in your household.

[00:56:57] Not as much as what appears in your household, probably in terms of political nerdom. But this was just great to watch. And it amazes me what gets people animated. Now, I've had a number of people and I've rolled my eyes, but I'm just using it as a data point. I've had a few people, a number of people reach out to me and say that this could be a sleeper issue, a sleeper issue, Becky, in some legislative races.

[00:57:23] My eyeballs almost rode out of my head because I, in my head, and please push back if I'm wrong. If you're upset about the state flag to this degree, I can pretty much tell you how you already are planning on voting. And so in terms of it being a sleeper, now, it may motivate some people in some districts, but my frustration, I shouldn't say frustration. I just want to point out that if you do a canvas of social media accounts from campaigns and candidates that are running statewide on the Republican side,

[00:57:52] I bet you will hear more, you will see more examples of them talking about the state flag than lowering gas prices. And what we can do to bring down the prices of gas and other things right now. And that's where I get, I want to just point out that I don't know that they're dialed in on how significant of an issue this is. Well, let me play devil's advocate a little bit. Of course. As my gears are kind of running here, I'm with you. I think I can also point to the type of person, voter, that this might motivate.

[00:58:21] And to be frank, it is the type of voters Republicans need to bring out who traditionally might not vote in midterm elections. So I can see something to that of in particular, and again, this is no numbers in front of me, a mass generalization based on what I see online and stuff. But I feel like a big part of that constituency of folks who are fired up about this that could be brought out to the polls are potentially MAGA voter males between the age of 25 and 50,

[00:58:49] who largely don't participate in midterm elections or who have already been kind of spun off by Trump and the MAGA world we talked about a little bit ago. And very interesting. I mean, I'd like to see some poll numbers on this, but I think the devil's advocate in me hadn't thought about that fact until just now. And I guess, I mean, if it brings out 5,000 voters, that could make or break the trifecta. Yes. I just, yes, I get it. It's silly. Yes.

[00:59:16] And so state flag, again, I just, and let me know if you, I think you agree with me, but I want to just speak. I want us to have an, we can have an agreement on this. We didn't like the old flag. We're not a big fan of the new flag. It would be great if we got a new flag and maybe we can, but this is not top 10 of our issues. And yes, exactly.

[00:59:38] I mean, I think this is, we have that joint frustration of exactly the Republican issue in a lot of things in Minnesota as we have Amy Klobuchar coming out being a pragmatic, thoughtful adult in the room. And Republicans, not all of them, but some of them, whether it's at BPOU conventions or on Twitter, are arguing about tampons in boys' bathrooms and, you know, state flags and different things that do rile up folks,

[01:00:02] but are not that pragmatic adult in the room that I feel like voters crave right now, especially with the fraud and ICE stuff going on. I think we want to look at somebody and say they are going to be in charge. They are going to get us back on track when it comes to Minnesota and our statewide and our legislature. You are an equal party on this podcast. If you had told me, Michael, this is one or two on my list, I think we would have had some off-air issues. I'm really, really glad. I breathed an internal sigh of relief when you said, when you agreed with me.

[01:00:32] Now, by the way, I want to give a shout out to the Hastings City Council. Community access all across the state. I got to tell you something. My family had a blast. I was so happy. That person going up to the mic. It was a blast. I love it. I loved it. Last little segment, just a few minutes, because I feel like you sent this to me. I hadn't seen it.

[01:01:00] It's just so I don't even know where to begin because it's so mind-boggling to me. I'm so glad we're videotaping these right now. I'm so glad we're going to stream this. Go ahead, Becky. When we came out of the 2022 presidential election, we talked a lot about, I'm sorry, the 2024 presidential election.

[01:01:17] We talked a lot about how Democrats missed the mark when it came to affordability and finances and the cost of eggs and how Americans get books are being impacted right now. That was, I think, something that even Democrats acknowledged that there was a little bit of a failure in. And then, you know, economics, taxes, spending, all still very high in might of what voters think and feel.

[01:01:41] This week, Governor, President Trump, I'm sorry, was asked whether Americans' financial situation motivates Trump in his deal with Iran. And President Trump, on camera, said, I do not think about Americans' financial situation. He went on to say, I only think about how we cannot let Iran have a nuclear weapon. Understandable. I don't know how his comms team heads literally didn't explode because, my God, you just verbalized. I don't think about Americans' financial situation.

[01:02:10] Now, did a lot of us think that? Does he have any idea or frame of context of how much a gallon of milk costs or, you know, a dozen eggs or anything that average Americans who are not multimillion-dollar business conglomerates? No. I don't think that that's something that I expected him to have a super great grasp at. Saying it out loud, this is something you just handed the most amazing gift to Democrats ever.

[01:02:40] Any Republican that tries to make a campaign issue over affordability and what Democrats are doing, this is your guy. This is your president. This is what he thinks. He doesn't think about it. But you're saying you're going to Congress and that's going to be your top priority in Congress. How are you going to do that when the president can't think about it, doesn't think about it, doesn't cross his mind? Wow. I tried to construct, just for sport, a worst sentence for him to say, and that still is the best. Terrible answer.

[01:03:06] And what I initially thought about, and again, I want to just make sure everyone's clear. I've never voted for Trump. Didn't support him. I want my president to succeed, okay? Because if the president succeeds, our country succeeds. Saying this is not good. And as someone who believes that there should be, I would like to, I think that divided government works better. My immediate reaction was, will this change Republicans in this state wanting to seek his support? Because this is a really bad statement.

[01:03:34] And again, tell, again, I think one of the most impactful things you've ever said on this podcast, aside from not liking Turkey, was storytelling. And the need to do that. This tells a story. This tells the story of an aloof, out-of-touch president who is not concerned and focused on one of the things in which they focus on. The economy. Clinton-Gore campaigned in 92, it's the economy, stupid. Okay? To talk about that stuff.

[01:04:03] And bluntly, it is the economy. And I think in over our last podcast episodes, and again, to compliment you, was on gas prices. When I was driving with my family across, when I was driving with one of my family members up to northern Minnesota, I was talking about our podcast episode. We were talking about gas prices. And I told the story about what you had said about, you know, milk and eggs are not advertised on street corners. Gas prices are. And that's more important than a flag right now.

[01:04:31] And when the president goes out there and says this, it's a problem. But again, I think particularly in this state, when Republicans, I think, are interested in trying to get his support, why would you do that? Why would you think that's a helpful statement? And so I'm continually stunned at how this president can construct sentences to hurt Republicans across the states.

[01:04:54] I think it also shows how much I think President Trump is interested in a foreign policy win for his legacy. And gas prices are, high gas prices are just going to be a byproduct of his zest for that to think. Yes, I absolutely do not think Iran should have a nuclear weapon. I want to be very clear about that. I don't think if you, but we can have lower gas prices and also ensure that Iran does not have nuclear weapons.

[01:05:21] And I think that's the problem here with this statement. And it's so crisp. It's so clean. It will be used. This election cycle, I think we're going to see a lot of this over the coming weeks and months. Absolutely. I mean, I just think it would shock me if there wasn't some messaging, you know, I don't know how they do comms meetings in the Oval Office. But in my experience working on campaigns and for electeds, we would have certainly had a conversation about how there is criticism, you know, for supporting the president's move.

[01:05:51] And Iran to ensure they don't get a nuclear weapon. That there is a lot of concern about gas prices. This is a historical context of gas prices. How do you answer a question, whether from a reporter or constituent, about that? Again, it's just one of those times that like wearing my comms hat, I think should be a really, really easy answer for somebody like the president who has been doing this now for eight, 10 years, however long.

[01:06:16] Is that simply if this was me, I mean, again, just pulling this out of my pocket, I would have said something of like, you know, I understand there are a lot of concerns about rising gas prices. I think that absolutely needs to be part of the conversation as we discuss a more domestic energy policy for the United States and how we can, you know, stop our foreign dependence on oil. But in this situation, we cannot let Iran have a nuclear weapon and address it. I understand the concerns. They're valid. We can solve them over here. But right now, this is our priority. And you still get the same gist of it.

[01:06:46] How he it just is like one of those. I just how that question answer was so bungled is astounding and really detrimental to Republicans everywhere. My last question this episode, are gas prices going to be over four dollars by election? I mean, they're almost there now. But you think they stay that way? We're going through summer and then Labor Day are notoriously high.

[01:07:10] I find it hard to believe that once we get to October, they're going to drop following the high summer and Labor Day. We'll talk about it more. I think it takes some time to unwind. You can't just very quickly push. You just can't quickly flip a switch and have gas prices go down. There's going to be there's a ramp down time. And I think of gas prices. I remember when this first started with the military conflict slash war with Iran that I was talking with someone.

[01:07:39] I said, wait till gas prices are four dollars a gallon. It's not going to get that way. I'm like, yeah, it will. And now sitting here in May and saying, is it a possibility? And asking the question if they could be gas prices above four dollars a gallon by election day. Gas prices are above four dollars a gallon on election day. Hovering at or above. It's going to be real tough for Republicans. Becky, I want to thank you for another action episode. I want to say two things, a little housekeeping from our missed episode.

[01:08:09] I want to give a shout out to Eric Michy. He has been watching this week talking about the Kids Online Safety Act, which is an advocacy point of save. We've had Eric on to talk about his work about suicide awareness. And I want to give a shout out to Eric for his continued advocacy for kids online saving, keeping kids safe online and the Kids Online Safety Act. But I also want to remember and give a plug out to we've never done this before.

[01:08:35] But Eric Michy asks and we do it, which is there is the History Theater in downtown St. Paul is opening up a new show this weekend. It's got a political bent to it. It's called Courting Harry. It runs through June 10th and it's written by Lee Blessing. And it tells the story of two Minnesota natives and lifelong friends who became on the Minnesota Supreme Court. Harry Blackman and Warren Burger. They were classmates in St. Paul and they went to the Supreme Court.

[01:09:02] It talks about that story as the legal analyst for the podcast. I thought you would you wouldn't mind that plug. Not at all. I always I think plays theater. I think it's wonderful. This has a political bent to it. And I wanted to give a shout out for those. This is a non-sponsored this. We're not paid to do this. I'm just throwing it out. Go check it out. It sounds like a really interesting play. I might take my family in the next week or two. And it's got a political bent to it. So I think it'd be fun. Love it. Thank you again, Becky, for this great episode.

[01:09:32] Thank you to all our listeners for joining us on this episode of The Breakdown with Brock Corbin and Becky. Before you go, show us some love for your favorite podcasts by leaving us a review on Apple Podcasts or on the platform where you listen. You can also follow us on our website and across all social media platforms at BB Breakpot. The Breakdown with Brock Corbin and Becky will be back next week. Thank you so much for joining us. Bye-bye.