Bonus Episode: A Break Down of the Biden and Trump Debate

[00:00:00] Welcome to the Break Down with Brodkorb and Becky, a weekly podcast that breaks down politics, policy and current affairs. I'm Becky Scherr. And I'm Michael Brodkorb. We are back with our second episode this week. Today we will be breaking down last night's presidential debate.

[00:00:26] In a historic moment, two presidents stood side by side to highlight why they should be elected for a second term in November. We are going to break down this cycle's first debate with Anna Matthews, executive director for the Republican Party of Minnesota, and Darwin Forsyth, communications director

[00:00:41] for the Minnesota DFL. This is Anna's second time on the Break Down, and while we have had Darwin's colleagues on before, this is his first time joining us on the show. We will start with an overall sentiment of moderators and the new rules established prior to the debate.

[00:00:55] We will then break down our views on who came out on top, where there were missed opportunities or moment sees, and what answers we were most impressed with. We will end by discussing what we can expect from the campaigns over the next 24, 48, 72 hours.

[00:01:09] Thanks for joining us and enjoy the show. We are excited to be back with another panel conversation. And we have voices today of all backgrounds. So we are joined with Anna Matthews from the MNGOP, Darwin Forsyth from the DFL, Michael Brodkorb, Politically Homeless, and Becky Scherr, Undecided Voters.

[00:01:31] We'll see if this conversation sways me at all. Last night had the first presidential debate. I want to start our conversation by just focusing on the format, the structure, the rules, the moderators, mute buttons, and how we felt over this debate being significantly different

[00:01:48] than what we've seen in previous debates. Anna, I want to throw it to you of did you go into it thinking you were going to like the structure? Did you come out of it liking the structure? Yeah.

[00:01:58] Honestly, Becky, when you're running for any office, you are going to be presented with all sorts of structures and different audiences and forums and all of that type of stuff. And I really do feel for candidates, your job, part of the game is to be able to thrive

[00:02:12] in those environments. And so even if you don't really like the structure, it's still up to you to do a good job. I actually thought that the structure last night was great. I think when people hear CNN, when Republicans hear CNN, they think that things will

[00:02:24] be a little bit more liberal. But some of the questions that they asked Biden were very direct. I thought they were very fair. I think that the time was fine. I think that the mute buttons were fine.

[00:02:35] The one thing I will say is that you get a very different vibe from the candidates when there's not an audience because most candidates, and this just isn't even Biden Trump, most candidates really do feed off of an audience.

[00:02:47] And it's just a little bit when you don't have an audience, not that it's bad or good. But I think that was really the difference last night is that there was not that audience for them to feed off of. Darwin, your thoughts.

[00:03:00] I actually agree with most of that. I personally actually like someone who's done debates, like all of you have on this podcast here. I actually like it when there's not an audience because I think it's just a more

[00:03:13] honest reflection of what the candidates are saying and thinking than if you're playing to a crowd. But crowd is usually maybe not in a presidential debate, but often they stack crowd based on who gets more of their supporters in the rooms. I thought that was good.

[00:03:29] I think the moderators were reputable people. I don't think it'll stop, but I think that people who are expecting on the other side, Jake Tapper and CNN to be liberal shills were, I think that was refuted by the professionals in which they handled it.

[00:03:47] Personally, I do think there's a role for a little bit more fact checking that being said, a huge caveat that I understand the challenge the moderators are facing with this particular election and with the Trump presidency in general on this. So overall, I think it was great.

[00:04:07] Michael, what's your take on the format? I thought the format was good. I allowed for there to be, there were, I think less distractions, less, it was, I think it was easier to keep the candidates on. Corraled, which is always a challenge in the debate that we didn't

[00:04:24] have to have the continual, please hold your applause until the end. We didn't need to pause and have those kind of audience interruptions. I do agree that I think that there would be nice if it was almost a perfect

[00:04:38] format. I would like to see if there would be some way in which we could incorporate in, if there are future debates this cycle is some type of platforming of fact checking. If that could be where they're streaming in maybe then if each candidate's,

[00:04:55] each candidate was allocated some space on the screen to have there be some fact checking or something on the screen or there was some type of way in which to put some type of fact checking in the process.

[00:05:06] But overall, I think the format of the debate was refreshing and my compliments to CNN and how it was put together and the campaigns for agreeing to it. I largely agree with the sentiment of all of you.

[00:05:18] I, when my initial thought when they came out on stage was that they were standing closer together than I anticipated them being. That didn't end up coming into play in any ways, but it was just the optics of it were a little different than I expected.

[00:05:32] One thing I do wish because I don't want to regurgitate everything everybody else said, my only real downfall with it is I wish the moderators actually held them to answer the question a little bit more. I know they tried.

[00:05:44] There were a lot of you have 36 seconds or you have 82 seconds left. Do you want to, do you have anything else to say about whatever the question was? I appreciated them trying to a lot that additional time to steer them back.

[00:05:57] And I will link an awesome NBC article, factoid platform report, whatever we want to call it, that breaks down a lot of this and it really, it shows how as the questions go through what the question was and how much the answer actually answered that question.

[00:06:12] And as you get halfway through, we no longer are answering the questions that are being asked. So I just wish there was a little bit more, but I do think again, it was structured to be a little bit more issue-based.

[00:06:21] They tried to make it a little bit more issue-based. The candidates tried to veer off of that, certainly, but mute worked well. I thought it was really refreshing. And yeah, I really enjoyed it. I will say we'll get into some time spent on the issues here shortly.

[00:06:36] I do like to go into my numbers here. The speaking time overall, Trump spoke for 40 minutes and 12 seconds and Biden spoke for 35 minutes and 41 seconds. So almost four and a half minutes longer that Trump spoke. And again, that is not because of allocation.

[00:06:51] That's the choices of the candidates. And yeah, that was four minutes as you can say a lot. But now I want to move into who we thought won the debate. And I think that one thing that is interesting here, and Michael, correct

[00:07:04] me if I'm wrong, based on previous conversations. I'm currently sitting a little undecided. I'm not sure if I'm going to vote Biden. I'm not going to hear a deal. I'm not going to vote Biden. I'm not sure if I'm going to vote for Trump or right in.

[00:07:18] So that's where I stand right now. Michael, I believe you've said before you're leaning towards a right in. Is that correct? I'm still writing in at this point. All right. Anna, are you I don't want to make assumptions here, but Ann,

[00:07:30] I'm assuming you're a Trump voter and Darwin. I'm assuming you're a Biden voter, correct? So that said, I want to just verify that or just make it clear that we have all different backgrounds here and all different thoughts of

[00:07:42] this, but go around Robin and say who we think came out of top on top of last last night's debate. Michael, can I start with you and put you on the spot of who do you think was the winner? Who do you think was the loser last night?

[00:07:54] I think first of all, I think that America lost last night in the debate. Number one, but I do think I think Trump had a stronger performance. I think there's some issues with Biden, but who won? First of all, yeah, I think America lost.

[00:08:06] I think Trump won the two on two debate. I think there's some issues Biden, but I'm curious what our guests also think. Anna, I think that Donald Trump vastly outperformed. I think that he was direct. I think that he actually stayed on focus very well.

[00:08:24] And he actually answered the questions and he is clearly competent and with it. I don't know how else to say it, besides from the minute that Biden walked out and was mumbling as he came onto stage.

[00:08:39] I just knew it was going to be a painful night to watch him. And the whole thing just went downhill from there. So I think that Trump showed competency. I think that he has a great record to stand on. And I think that he was honest and direct.

[00:08:52] And I think that's why he's polling so well. And that's why people like him. Darwin. I don't think there's any sugarcoating. This is not Joe Biden's best performance. I also don't think that the flip side of that.

[00:09:07] I also don't think that Donald Trump won, quote unquote, the debate. I think that the president's raspy voice and stumbling over his words on some early answers were not good optics and that Biden HQ definitely has their work cut out for them.

[00:09:21] But there are two overall points I want to make here that I think have been a little lost in the chattering class debate here. It's every president seeking a second term going back at least 20 years has struggled in their first debate.

[00:09:36] Didn't spell the end of their campaigns, even when those debates were happening in October as opposed to this one happening in June. And the second here and some folks have made this point is I do not believe that Donald Trump did anything to dispel the various

[00:09:54] the very serious concerns that voters still have about sending him back to the White House and they arguably reinforced some of those concerns. I think, I guess I would dispute with my counterpart over at the Minnesota Republican Party would say I don't think that he answered the questions.

[00:10:12] I certainly don't think he made a good faith effort to answer them truthfully. He also dug in on Roe v. an overturning Roe v. Wade, some tax cuts for the rich and refused to give a straight answer about whether he'd accept this election's results,

[00:10:29] not just across the country, but I think especially here in Minnesota. This is a state where a lot of people pride ourselves on Minnesota's civic participation or history of turning out and voting in elections. He is just last month he was here saying he won Minnesota in 2020,

[00:10:47] despite the 2020 election being particularly close to Minnesota. I don't think that continuing to reinforce some of those fundamental concerns about his candidacy will serve Donald Trump. So Biden campaign definitely has some work cut out for them.

[00:11:04] I don't think that it was a runaway good night for Donald Trump. I'm in the middle of you two, so I certainly thought that it was rougher than I expected for President Biden. I think he had a first big stumble about 13 minutes in

[00:11:20] and I thought that Trump came out very measured and for the first 70ish minutes maybe I was very impressed with how reserved and calm he appeared, how measured his some of his responses were.

[00:11:31] He didn't have some of the wild faces, but that said, I don't think like you said, Darwin, I don't necessarily think that he had a stellar performance where he answered some questions as best as some voters would like him to do.

[00:11:43] I think while he didn't take the debate that I think Biden was trying to get him to take halfway, lots of times Biden was directing towards towards Trump. We called him a loser trying to reel him in and fire him up.

[00:11:54] I think and I think Trump while he didn't fall into that for the first maybe half of the debate, we did see him get fired up and some of the stuff we're seeing on Twitter and I know Franklin's in this focus group was

[00:12:04] saying that they didn't like how much time those spent with some of those fiery attacks and with both of the candidates focusing more on what the past was and what they've done in their first term versus what we can expect them to do in their second term.

[00:12:18] And I think there was some common frustration with that from viewers that I saw on Twitter. So I think both candidates had some good moments. Both candidates had some missed opportunity. So I want to get into that and chat through what stood out to this group.

[00:12:34] What are some of those? And you can just share one or two and we can go around and each just talk about some of our favorite moments, some of our cringe worthy moments, anything that somebody seized on a moment, any questions that they just bungled.

[00:12:49] Darnwin, I want to start with you. Is there any key moments good or bad that stood out for you from either candidate? I do think that one key moment was, as I said before, Donald Trump refusing to say whether he'd accept the election results if he doesn't

[00:13:03] like that result. I think that one thing that has held Trump back throughout this campaign rightly is voters' concerns over his behavior after losing the 2020 election culminating in January 6th. And I think that he reinforced those concerns, whether

[00:13:22] not you think other concerns outweigh that or how you respond to that. I don't think that if you walked into that debate or were an undecided voter concerned about Donald Trump's respect for our democratic institutions, I don't think you walked away from that with those concerns addressed.

[00:13:40] I think the one good moment for Joe Biden, I'm sure we'll talk about some of his stumbles, but I do think he gave a very strong response. I don't remember what was verbatim when talking about the role, the presidency and how it's not being president doesn't give you

[00:13:57] the justification to enact your personal retribution or vendettas against those you disagree with. I think that Joe Biden wins this election. It will be in large part because his character and decency break through in this election. And I think that exchange was emblematic of sort of a path

[00:14:17] forward for Biden from here. Anna, what stood out to you last night? Again, I just have to repeat this. Joe Biden is so old and he is ailing and he is incoherent. And I think that the jokes go around on Twitter and you see the TikTok things.

[00:14:33] And this was really like the first official time in a while that Americans have seen our president like he is representing us. He is in charge of the country. That is our leader. That is our commander-in-chief. And he can't even string together coherent answers for two minutes.

[00:14:51] That is so concerning. And I think that last night Trump was much more reserved. He was much more on point. But I think that everybody just felt sympathy for Biden. And I think that everybody felt this concern like this is the hand.

[00:15:06] These are the hands that our country is in right now and we're not in good shape. And again, if you look at the poll numbers, even in Minnesota, Trump is pulling ahead. And so while Darwin, he may not have beswaged some concerns or other concerns.

[00:15:19] I think that when you're looking at the polling, there are clearly issues that matter more to voters, right? There are certain issues that stand out more. And I think that the Democratic Party over the next couple of months is going to just beat on certain issues.

[00:15:34] And I think that what they're missing is that those are not the issues that are very important to Americans, regardless of what people think of them. They're still willing to take Donald Trump over Joe Biden, who again is just mentally not well.

[00:15:47] I don't think that anybody can say with a straight face that he has to be in charge of our entire country. It's really sad. Like one of my friends called me after the debate and he said, my wife is a palliative care PT.

[00:15:59] And she said, Joe Biden looks like one of my patients. And she's a fairly moderate voter. People see that it's concerning. I'm going to before I turn into Michael, I'm going to share a couple of my favorite moments

[00:16:10] and feel free to jump in if you if these spark any reminders of some of your favorites. So just put not some lines that I liked. Love Donald Trump when he said, I don't know what he said, but that's OK. I don't think he knows what he said.

[00:16:23] Great moment for Trump. I loved when Biden said, this guy is three years younger than me, but far less competent. I thought that was a winning line from President Biden. I thought he made it his point that he was trying to make

[00:16:37] one criticism that I did have as a comms staffer for a while. You're never supposed to regurgitate the attack against you when giving a response. And while we had a former president on a debate stage, say, I did not have sex with porn star.

[00:16:54] And that was like a jaw dropping that you just hearing it out of his mouth on the debate stage was a little jarring to me. So I will come back before I get to Michael and I have a couple more to share.

[00:17:05] Darwin, I do want to see if you have any response to any of the criticisms Anna shared and your thoughts of the performance last night. Yeah, absolutely. Just one campaign or technical thing. I don't think that the publicly available polling or the privately

[00:17:23] available polling for that matter supports the idea that Trump has pulled ahead in Minnesota. But and I think that's reflected in where they have and haven't invested here. But except from that, I do absolutely dispute and can say with a straight face

[00:17:38] that the debate did not concern me about Joe Biden's fitness for the presidency. The optics and politics of the delivery. I think we've talked about that clearly here. But I think that what you saw at the debate was still a president

[00:17:51] who not only has a command and understanding of the issues, a dammering and wrong number here and there aside, but also someone who cares about the issues and feels a sense of responsibility to the issues into the country with much more seriousness than his challenger here.

[00:18:09] Donald Trump's his investment in the issues, like and how much he cares about them and how they benefit other people was noticeably absent on the debate stage last night. He was very animated when he was talking about how he thinks

[00:18:27] that he's being indicted because of Joe Biden's secret hand behind it all about how he's being prosecuted about his very strong feelings about President Biden's son, Hunter, but the his actual mastery of the issues itself. We talk about inflation a lot.

[00:18:45] It's one of the first things President Trump's economic agenda. And I do think this came through a little bit in the first part of the debate. He has some of the most straightforward policies of any candidate running right now that would increase inflation, increase prices,

[00:19:02] like these tariff policies. So I do think that came through. I do think that matters and it didn't leave me question whether or not President Biden was up to the job. I think that's very clear. We'll get into a little bit more of that issues here shortly.

[00:19:17] Michael, I do want to see if you had any key moments that stood out to you positive, negative or the like. I think we've been discussing it a bit about Biden's presence on the stage. Just a couple of things.

[00:19:29] I think that the Biden's campaign, I think what surprised me was his voice initially and I think where the Biden campaign, I think made a tactical mistake was not informing, I think the media in advance as to he's had a cold.

[00:19:42] He's going to come in with a raspy voice. That would have, I think, set a lot of expectations and that would have been known in advance. There was a little bit of a shock I had when I heard him speak that he had been called in.

[00:19:53] Presidential presidents are human beings. Candidates for office get sick and that impacts their performance. And so I think Biden's campaign should have done a better job and the White House should have done a better job of just articulating,

[00:20:04] say, he's coming in, he's been doing the Bay Prep, he's raspy and at least prepare folks for that. I think his overall performance was concerning. I do think that there are issues. And I think there was, I think a surprise in how he came across.

[00:20:21] And I do think that's going to be a discussion going forward. I have long held the position as someone who didn't vote for Trump that the more that this election is about Trump, the more likely I think it is, it's going to be,

[00:20:35] the more likely it is, I think it's going to come down to him and that's going to detract from having there be a conversation about Biden's record. And so I think Biden's performance last night, I think is going to flip that up for a little bit.

[00:20:49] I think a lot of the discussion coming out of the debate, I think appropriately is focused on Biden's performance because there was a shock, I think that went across with pundits and other people last night when they saw his performance. Trump did Trump.

[00:21:04] Becky, you and I had a podcast leading up discussing the rules. I think the rules of the debate properly restrained as best they could Trump's behavior. And I understand now why the Trump campaign agreed to those rules because it did restrain him.

[00:21:20] There were a couple brief moments as we predicted where we were going to hear his voice, we did hear his voice. I don't think that I think there was misstatements by Trump, misstatements by Biden, but honestly, as someone who again

[00:21:34] didn't vote for Trump 1620 and 24, not going to vote for him again, I think the Biden performance is what his folks are going to talk about. And I think if there was quote unquote a loser or a moment of that, I would characterize his entire performance last night

[00:21:49] and just his presence on the stage. And I have a feeling that you might have something to say about a quote unquote cold that President Biden came down with 30 minutes into the debate. That's just what it is. It's a quote unquote cold.

[00:22:03] They said how is he going to do tonight? If he doesn't do well, we'll say he has a cold. He's going to cross our fingers and hope that it goes well. Again, Americans have been watching the Instagram reels

[00:22:13] and the TikToks and the videos that go viral on Twitter. Like as much as people say like even us for today sitting around talking about this, we can say whatever we want, but people are going to believe their eyes and they've been seeing this for months and months.

[00:22:28] And when the Biden campaign says, oh sorry, he has a cold. It's yeah, he has a cold swing. There's just always something and I don't know. It always amazes me how much longer they think that they can cover for him. I mean, I just, it's that simple.

[00:22:42] Like maybe he did have a cold, but if that's Joe Biden with a cold, that's still very concerning. If that's Joe Biden without cold, still very concerning. And I don't disagree. One thing that really struck me with this too is I just

[00:22:58] as the debate was starting, I saw a tweet come across that somebody had retweeted a tweet from Joe Biden before about 30 minutes before the campaign holding a can that we talked about it on our last episode about how Donald

[00:23:10] Trump basically alluded to them needing to give Biden cocaine or a shot or something to be able to perform. And so I loved this chance, this opportunity that the Biden campaign took and let's lean into the skid here. And this is just water coming energetic feeling pretty jacked

[00:23:27] up. And then 30 minutes later we saw that. And to me, that was the opportunity as well. So at 7 30, they posted that and then at 8 30, they're saying he had a cold. Is it he has jacked up or has a cold?

[00:23:40] And Darren, I don't want to put you on the spot, but I do want to give you the opportunity to wrap up this, the cold and that kind of if you want to take it. Yeah, no, absolutely. So I don't think that the president having cold, I

[00:23:54] don't, first of all, I reject the idea that they just made it up. I think that there's even if you believe they would do that, I think that as press people, we all know there's too many risks of being caught lying in order to actually lie.

[00:24:09] But I think that independent of the cold, it was not the president's best debate performance again, not unique to him. I don't think there's a lot of evidence that it impacts the job that he's actually performing as president, especially because I think he has a great

[00:24:25] record to run on. But yeah, it's true that the president and his campaign have some work to do to address the optics from last night. And I also think that going back to the, you know, the soda can or the salt, I can't remember what drink it was.

[00:24:45] That whole thing was prompted by Donald Trump implying that his opponent was going to be using cocaine or some other form of some illegal drug. That's crazy. We, I feel like sometimes we get so used to like, oh,

[00:25:02] Trump will be trumped to be like in a vacuum, this should be insane. We should not accept this as a baseline norm. That's obviously in my self interest as a DFL Constructor to say that. I also genuinely think it's true and the people who

[00:25:16] aren't die hard straight ticket Democrats can still find like when they take a step back, be like, oh, I've heard this guy say this stuff for eight, nine years now. But do I really want to be hearing that and seeing

[00:25:29] sort of the stability in our politics degraded even further over the course of four more years? I think that is also going to be weighing on people's minds as a segue into what you were talking about, Becky. Thank you. I do want to keep us moving here.

[00:25:45] I want to chat a little bit more about the issues. I want to start by patting ourselves, Michael and myself on the back because when we listed out what issues we thought were going to be the top and gaining the most minutes of conversation at the debate,

[00:25:57] we nailed it. So we're going to start out with foreign policy was the top ringer here. 15 minutes spent on that all the way down to democracy in number two that got four minutes less just over 10 minutes. Then the economy, immigration, abortion, race,

[00:26:11] veterans, and then we get into two minutes spent on a variety of attacks, tax reforms, climate change, their age, et cetera. Does this as you guys are out in the fields and talking to voters, this I assume rings true with

[00:26:26] what you're hearing as the top issues and why we dedicated the most time to these questions. You're both nodding along perfect. So when I'm going to throw it back to you, what are there any standout moments again, either positive or negative where you felt Joe

[00:26:38] Biden had aside from some of the earlier articulated that Joe Biden had a good answer on some of these top one or that Donald Trump had a poor answer or maybe just reiterated why the Democrats don't believe that he is set to be president to

[00:26:54] manage some of these issues. Well, in addition to the ones I rattled off about abortion, tax cuts to the rich and democracy, I also think that one that got a lot of attention was his talk about NATO going out of business,

[00:27:09] his sort of dancing around some of the questions about Vladimir Putin. I think that that will also reinforce even for many people who don't traditionally vote for Democrats but believe in the role of the United States in protecting democracy, not just here

[00:27:28] but around the world and freedom in our values and our national security interests. I think that Donald Trump did not quite himself well and reassure either voters here or our allies that he'd continue to be an ally in if he won a second term.

[00:27:46] I think that people have very real concerns not just about Vladimir Putin and Ukraine but about just the role of NATO and our commitment to NATO as a country if he wins another term, our commitment to frankly like Taiwan or other democracies where authoritarians are sying

[00:28:07] their ability to encroach on them. I think that foreign policy was another telling moment there. Anna. Let me preface my answer by saying this, when people think about the Biden presidency there are very obvious things that stand out to them. Right?

[00:28:24] So if you want to talk about foreign policy, everyone in their mind has that photo of the plane leaving Afghanistan and hearing the news reports that happened and seeing the people want to get out. It's heartbreaking like I could, I just, I don't even talking about it.

[00:28:37] I imagine being in that situation, it's so sad. But that is burned into every American's brain. And so when Joe Biden stands on stage and says foreign policy is better under me, no troops are dying anywhere in the world. Again, he can say whatever he wants but people

[00:28:50] know that's not true. When they talk about the economy and he says the economy was terrible under Trump, people remember buying gas for less than two bucks a gallon and I think that again we as, I don't want to call us talking heads but

[00:29:04] the chattering class or whatever, we can talk about this stuff all that we want but I think that Americans are concerned about themselves and their families and they want what's best for their future. And I think that they understand these issues

[00:29:17] and their reality is going to dictate how they vote. And Joe Biden can say, foreign policy is great under me but there wasn't this mass panic. People weren't scared when Trump pulled us out of the Paris Climate Accord. They weren't super scared when we told

[00:29:31] the other organizations in the world they have to start contributing, funding towards some of these efforts but when you saw what happened in Israel people are scared. When we talk about Ukraine, people are scared. When we pulled out of Afghanistan, people are scared.

[00:29:47] Just the suicide rate of our veterans in the country. That hits so close to home for so many people and those are the things that are burned into voters' brains and I don't think it really matters what Joe Biden says on stage but those like gut-wrenching panic moments

[00:30:01] we have them from the past couple of years and that's what people are going to remember when they vote and I think that Trump actually did a very good job of recalling some of those disasters last night and bringing it back to those things on the stage.

[00:30:13] I'm going to share one frustration with both sides and then a semi-little rant. There was one concerning thing that when Trump was speaking that I believe he almost implied that Hamas would not have attacked Israel had he been president and while I do believe that President Trump

[00:30:30] exuded a lot more confidence in Israel as our top ally in the Middle East I felt like that was a little bit of a reach and it just made me roll my eyes a little bit. I do also think that Biden tiptoed around

[00:30:43] but with the chat about democracy I don't think he quite nailed I think he missed the opportunity there to share what's clear that the Biden campaign wants to do is that Trump is a threat to the biggest threat to democracy

[00:30:57] and that's what we saw a lot in the pre-spin and lead up and so I thought those were two things that I think their answers missed a little bit and then I have to rant real quick we all know that the last like 20-ish minutes

[00:31:07] of the debate went off the rails they stopped answering the questions talked about what they wanted to responded to the last thing we talked about golf scores and so many different random things but there was a question and I tweeted about this last night

[00:31:19] but there was a question brought up about the cost of childcare and so I have my son turns two on Sunday we'd like to have more the cost of childcare is so astronomical and Michael and I talk a lot about and I'm sure again you guys know

[00:31:31] both in your strategy that suburban women in particular are huge voting block that both sides are trying to attract and I thought that this was an awesome opportunity I even turned my husband like zip it right now I want to hear what they have to say

[00:31:44] and for six minutes that were allotted to this two minutes for each of their actual answers and then one minute responded Biden said two sentences so I will give him credit that he actually addressed the question Trump did not it was such a frustrating thing

[00:31:59] and not that I think that there are a lot of undecided suburban moms sitting here watching the debate last night but I think to me it was just really like a knife in the heart because I feel like it's been such a failure and both sides have really

[00:32:13] failed to address and see it as such a failure of the childcare cost in addition to everything else costing more and inflation in the economy and I think that was just one where I really was just like so frustrated that we went off the rails

[00:32:26] and we couldn't even get any answer anything from these candidates of what we're going to do when people having two kids in daycare are spending $3,000 a month insane so that's my end of my little rant because I want to make sure we're being mindful of time

[00:32:41] and keep us moving here Michael on the issues anything that stood out to you positive or negative from these two candidates I think the I think one of the reasons why I think America lost last night was because I don't think there was

[00:32:54] as much as the debate was set up in a way in which there could have been a policy discussion there wasn't as much as I would have liked to have seen because of the performance and because of the candidates I will say

[00:33:04] Becky you made a great point I was following you on social media that was a missed opportunity I think it really gets to an issue that we've talked about I was also frustrated with a little bit of the golf discussion

[00:33:14] it only lasted for a minute or two but it just seemed to be another example of I think of where America I think of the 17 degree loss last night and having that discussion I do think again independent of the candidates on stage

[00:33:28] I do have a buy-in with the format I think that is the format in which to have the discussion and I applaud CNN and both campaigns for agreeing and platforming that format because I truly believe because

[00:33:42] Becky one of the things we've talked about with our guests before is one of the things we've discussed is the format of these debates and I think that's the way in which to do things and the internet is on the computer we don't need a live audience

[00:33:54] people can watch from a distance and we can get those opportunities to have those discussions I wish I think it was such a new concept and a new way of doing debates I think maybe through both of them for a loop a little bit

[00:34:06] in terms of just the process but I think television stations media outlets and the internet is a new way of doing debates and I think that's the way television stations, media outlets anyone who is doing debate should lean into that platform in that format

[00:34:22] because I really think it could lead to more substantive discussions although I did really appreciate a tweet I saw that had it said the next moderator of the debate or the moderator of the next debate and it was a picture of Jim Nance and like totally concur

[00:34:38] very supportive of that situation love Jim Nance alright we are gonna go to our last question it's 10 am what is next? now we are in the 12 hours 24 hours, 48 hours post-debate Anna what are Donald Trump and Republicans what are we expecting from them what are we gonna see

[00:34:58] and what's the path forward I think that Republicans are going to keep cruising like I said the polling numbers are looking very good the fundraising numbers are looking very good they're making investments across the country and I think that contrary to what

[00:35:12] the three of you have said I think that his performance last night Trump's performance was very different from what we've seen in the past he didn't attack the debate moderators he didn't attack CNN as an outlet he really didn't throw serious personal insults at Joe Biden

[00:35:26] right? Biden is the one who took Trump's bait on that gulf question I think that he was more restrained and again Biden was the one I don't want to say he was like swearing on stage the language was a little bit

[00:35:40] again not that it's bad to say hello to him on a debate stage but I it was just interesting that I don't know I was surprised and so I think the Trump campaign just has to keep cruising honestly if I were the Biden campaign

[00:35:52] today I'm trying to figure out what Joe Biden looks like without a cold and how to get him in front of people and showcase his strengths and maybe he can't do debates again maybe he needs to do something else but I'd be figuring out

[00:36:06] how to show him to America so that his strengths are highlighted and I'd be figuring out an answer to the economy question I'd be figuring out an answer to the immigration question I'd be figuring out an answer to some of these foreign policy issues

[00:36:16] if this is the last question Becky I do want to say nobody's touched on that immigration blunder that happened last night I think that was the most telling moment of the whole debate and if the Biden administration's answer to this

[00:36:32] which again this is the top line of what it was last night there was a little bit more nuance but it was we need abortion rights because a woman got raped by an immigrant that cannot be the answer no American is going to accept that as the answer

[00:36:46] so they have a lot of work to do I think that they I'm glad that I don't work for the Biden campaign I'll just say that because it would be a bad Friday that's a really bad note to end the week on Darwin

[00:36:58] I guess I probably assume you're also glad you don't work for the Trump campaign but what are your thoughts in the 24 or 48 72 hours post campaign what is the Biden campaign what are Democrats what can we expect to see yeah I definitely am

[00:37:12] glad I don't work for the Trump campaign just because it helps me sleep better at night on a day-to-day basis but yeah no just one point to start out with I just fundamentally dispute the idea that President Trump did not resort to personal insults in that debate

[00:37:28] I think that that record will correct itself did I say serious personal insults I'm not saying he didn't insult anybody but it certainly wasn't what we've seen in the past right like in the past he's come on stage and he says CNN you suck

[00:37:44] you're the worst moderator you're a dishonorable journalist that wasn't the tone last night so I do think even if I'm not I think that President Trump criticism of President Biden's child in particular like that stuck out to me as a moment sort of emblematic of Donald Trump's character

[00:38:00] and the fact that there might have been some guardrails placed on him but I think it does underscore the concerns when he's president and not subject to the rules and whims of a moderator of how he's going to conduct himself in a second term where he's very bitter

[00:38:16] and motivated by revenge but to Becky's question about how the what comes next I think that the Biden campaign has plenty of work to do I still think that's June that's important for people to keep perspective about elections do not end in June even when

[00:38:36] a candidate does not have a good or bad night I think that Democrats often tend to oscillate wildly between extreme overconfidence and extreme despair I don't think either of those are helpful to a campaign or a party I think it's just about doing the work

[00:38:52] and making sure that the next hour for many weeks we have a lot of people who are in the same position as we have had that we do everything we can with them in Minnesota specifically I still feel very good about where we are the DFL has

[00:39:10] a very robust infrastructure in place we're far ahead on offices building our organizing program we have a great slate of candidates that were proud to stand behind endorsed not ones that we have up and down the ticket that's going to be a contrast between us here from

[00:39:28] President Biden's on down we're not afraid to support our candidates I think that from Donald Trump to Roy Swight to some of the congressional legislative candidates that the GOP should not expect a to cruise to keep cruising to victory so to put it Michael any foresight from you

[00:39:50] let me just say that if the next 24 to 48 to 72 hours are critical for the Biden campaign there is one campaign that is leaving this debate with energy and enthusiasm and that's the Trump campaign there is a campaign that has serious questions as to the competency of their candidate

[00:40:10] the strength of their candidate the ability of their candidate to perform and lead in that office and I think the Biden campaign is coming into the 24 to 48 to 72 hours a very serious a very serious time for them I think they need to do some self reflection

[00:40:26] I mean you need to stabilize and recalibrate this race and show that their candidate is does have the physical stamina the mental capabilities the physical capabilities to lead and to perform in office I think that they're in a very tough situation for all of the talk

[00:40:46] of Biden being replaced on the ticket as much as I would like to see that and I think a lot of people would like to see Donald Trump replaced on the Republican ticket I think that process is difficult to do I think those discussions should be had

[00:41:00] because this is a serious strike against the Biden campaign and it raises a lot of questions about the competency of that campaign went into the preparation and what went into the debate and the next as I said the next 24 to 48 to 72 hours are going to be

[00:41:16] very critical for the Biden campaign for the Trump campaign I think that they need to continue to stay focused as they have been on this campaign I'm not a supporter of Donald Trump I'm not voting for him but I think the opportunity for the Trump campaign

[00:41:30] is if they could if their candidate could show little grace and a little bit of compassion and find a way to acknowledge Biden's shortcomings last night rather than through some viral view or some other discussion I don't know if the campaign is capable of doing that

[00:41:44] but they could really soften yet and still continue to add some fuel to the discussion by discussing it in some responsible ways I don't support Donald Trump's campaign but that being said I would much rather be in Trump's campaign for the next 24 to 48 to 72 hours

[00:42:02] than I would be Biden's campaign because I think the longevity of that campaign as to whether they're going to succeed and navigate over the summer months here is going to be decided very quickly and we'll see what happens today, tomorrow and over the weekend Absolutely

[00:42:18] I'm sure next week we'll chat a little bit about some fundraising numbers that I expect to come out I've been enjoying watching the betting market on this and how that changes we'll see official polls come out and see if there's any impact on their race

[00:42:32] but again largely as much as I love debates as much as we all love debates do voters actually watch or care or listen in my experience not a ton so we'll see if the overall polls do get impacted and I certainly think in the coming weeks

[00:42:48] as we have conventions on both sides we will see if anything changes, if there's any follow and how things go moving forward hopefully to a second debate if that continues to be the case before we wrap up I want to give you each an opportunity

[00:43:02] to share where folks can follow you or your organization on Twitter or a website whatever you want to plug Darwin we'll start with you I am Darwin Forsyth that is my Twitter handle it's very straightforward my first and last name and you can follow

[00:43:18] the Minnesota DFL on Twitter on the small chance that our listeners here do not already Perfect Anna Aft M-N-G-O-P for the party and my Twitter handle is Anna E. Mathews I'm Mathews this with one T correct? That is correct Becky, thank you

[00:43:36] Perfect, thank you guys both for joining us it was a really good honest conversation obviously you both have different jobs, different opinions, different viewpoints and stand on different sides of the political spectrum but we appreciate you being willing to come on here and have a good honest conversation

[00:43:52] about what we saw last night and what we're hoping to see in the future we hope to have you both back soon whether together or separately and thank you again Thanks so much for having us Thank you Becky, thank you Michael Good to see you again Thank you

[00:44:09] Becky, we just did a post presidential debate analysis discussion with Anna Mathews the executive director of the Minnesota Republican Party Minnesota and Darwin Forseth who's the communications director for the DFL your take on the discussion I loved it, I have a lot more notes that we didn't

[00:44:27] even get to because I just really enjoyed being part of the conversation You and I both know have been in these roles where you yes believe what you're doing but also have a job to do and both of these folks had to do their

[00:44:41] job, they are backing their candidates they're backing their policies and they're backing the talking points that come down but I really truly think that they did a really good job both articulating what their candidate, how they performed and some of the issues and I'll start

[00:44:55] out with saying I appreciated that Darwin right off the bat acknowledged Biden's performance, I think it is an achievement in the room and had he not that would have been odd so I appreciate his willingness to be honest about that, I thought that was really great and Anna

[00:45:11] obviously she did her job too and really supporting President Trump and his measured calm approach to things. I loved the conversation we have some more topics that I want to get into with you that I didn't feel maybe would be respectful of our guests

[00:45:25] and having some of that on there but your thought on our conversation I thought both of them were great, first of all I had the opportunity to meet Anna and of course doing this podcast because she works with the chairman David Hannon, I know Darwin from the

[00:45:39] 2022 election cycle because he was with the Walls campaign. I think both of them are great, I think that they're very good advocates in their roles so they were very appreciative that both of them would be willing to come on and go head to head again to each other

[00:45:53] I think it's a great dynamic and I hope to have them on discussing this as well as the election cycle. I think the DFL and the Biden campaign are in a tough spot today and I think Darwin I'm not surprised that he handled it

[00:46:05] the way that he did head on great job dealt with it didn't shy away from it and was I think gave a measured very measured and appropriate response to the last night's performance I think that there's a lot of questions today and again I

[00:46:19] don't want to be naive to how the legal challenges that presented itself today with the Biden campaign I just think the Biden campaign is in a much tougher spot today and I think both Trump and Biden are unfit for office and I think that the discussion

[00:46:33] we had it was very interesting just because I think your question about where we're going to be 28, 48, 72 hours from now I think it's going to be very interesting to see I think it's going to be very interesting to see because I think the Biden

[00:46:45] campaign has a lot of work to do today to stabilize a hemorrhaging campaign a campaign that is in a tough spot but overall huge props great job running the discussion and to Anna Matthews and to Darwin of course I thank you for coming on

[00:47:01] and we're absolutely going to have you on again because you guys hit it out of the park very insightful conversation from two professional spin meisters and strategists and tacticians those two are at the top of their game and it was great to have them on the podcast

[00:47:13] absolutely I do want to chat through a couple other things just with the two of us here so last night probably about 30, 45 minutes in I got served an ad on Twitter from Senate Republicans they bounced on their opportunity they had videos ready and they said for everyone watching

[00:47:31] or everyone in Montana watching this debate right now remember that John Tester claims Joe Biden is totally healthy and fine and they had a video and I thought wow I thought what a great way what a good spin not only are you now it's a double dip right

[00:47:47] you're hammering home Biden and he's doing news and fitness for office and then tying a competitive race John Tester to him and I have to imagine they're doing this across the country I loved it I love a good spin

[00:48:01] I love a good tie it was something I wasn't anticipating during the debate it was seizing on the moment and mad props I would agree and let's talk about that because one of the issues that I've had about Donald Trump is his ability to

[00:48:15] be a team player and the down ballot races and I thought that Trump would be a hindrance we had Kip and John Roloh and Kip Christensen and John Roloh talking about the Biden the Trump event in Minnesota and how and I was surprised at how unifying it was

[00:48:29] and it was a great message and it was a good strong event for the Minnesota GOP having Trump here was much more of a collaborative event we've also discussed Scott Jensen a year ago him being the gubernatorial nominee in 22 and a little bit of

[00:48:43] Roy Swight and some of these other candidates the Democrats are experiencing what Republicans have raised concerns about I raised about was Biden having an impact on the down ballot races because I had a very difficult time watching what happened last night on stage

[00:49:01] and saying that's going to be a net positive for the Democrats that was just a top of the ticket problem and I want to be consistent because I discussed the top of the ticket problem about Jensen and other issues and I discussed that Trump could have some issues

[00:49:17] being a team player in some of this stuff and so I think that the Democrats are struggling today and rightfully they should struggle because I think there's not and I think it is a self create it's a problem that they created themselves who was

[00:49:33] the most who won last night's debate I should have said was Dean Phillips won last night's debate because Dean Phillips has been saying this and we talked about this Becky, damn it. We talked about that I liked Dean Phillips because I thought he was right

[00:49:47] I absolutely thought that Dean Phillips right about how he articulated we had a lot and we had discussions about where he saw the landscape what was going on that manifested itself last night and I think that the Biden campaign is in a real pickle today

[00:50:01] because what they have to do now is they have to get their candidate out and they have to stabilize this issue and that's a much different work product to deal with Trump can come out of that debate and our discussion was a part of it

[00:50:19] as I was watching the debate I was thinking about all the breakdown that you had done of all the rules in the discussion and I kept watching that debate and seeing myself Trump can play the part he, it was I've never once, I don't think

[00:50:35] last night was probably the most time I've ever said in the house, damn it, Becky and I were right I was standing in front of the TV set saying Becky and I were right, we called this, we said this was going to happen Trump looked that format

[00:50:47] last night, Trump could follow the rules yes, he could follow the rules and he did it and he gave a little bit of the flavor of throwing out stuff to his supporters but he largely followed the debate and you want to know what was the biggest

[00:51:01] challenge to me that they agreed to and why I stopped tweeting the split screen the split screen was the issue because I maybe like you two you're doing two things at once, you're watching the debate, you're listening to the debate while you're simultaneously checking social media

[00:51:19] and I had just started I had sent out a tweet that says I'm going to be live tweeting this and watching this and then I pause and I'm like, I couldn't stop watching it and some of my kids were downstairs

[00:51:31] and I told them to come make sure they were watching it because it was historic because the first presidential debate between the principles was Kennedy versus Nixon in 1960 and before you say it, I was not I did not watch that debate but for people who

[00:51:47] watched that debate on TV they thought that Kennedy won those who listened to the debate thought that Nixon won and I wanted to watch much more of the screen than I normally do so I stopped tweeting and I put out a note that I stopped tweeting

[00:52:03] and it wasn't as doing as much because it was that split screen context that was just so amazing to me because we have discussed I think the age of the candidates and we've expressed some concerns about the age of the candidates and again

[00:52:17] I don't speak for you but correct if I'm wrong I think our position was if this was a race about if age and was the deciding factor yes, Biden is older but Trump shows more intensity and grasp of just the presence on the stage because both

[00:52:37] of the candidates are old, respectfully they're old. I think the split screen coupled with Biden's speech his gait and pattern and his I just think overall did not show stability and confidence in his candidacy and what was going on and so Trump can leave having performed on stage

[00:52:55] and followed largely followed the rules and Biden largely followed the rules but Trump is leaving with so much more momentum today and the Biden campaign is leaving with a lot of questions about that and look, let me just say this, let me also say this to you

[00:53:11] I don't suffer from Trump derangement syndrome I don't like Donald Trump I haven't liked Donald Trump since 15 since he, I never liked him I didn't vote from 16, I didn't vote from 20 I didn't vote from 24 but what you hear a lot from people

[00:53:27] when you don't like Donald Trump, they say oh, you have Trump derangement syndrome and blah blah blah, you can't discuss him we've had a lot of discussion on this podcast about Donald Trump and I've tried to learn and listen, I obviously have my perspective on it

[00:53:41] but I can at least have conversations about and give some analysis on the race and tell you where my stance is I think that what I saw last night was a little bit of Trump derangement syndrome from the opposite side in a sense that I think there are

[00:53:57] Democrats right now who despise Donald Trump so much that they're unwilling to look at themselves and see what the option is I stand by my position that if the Republicans had nominated someone else, this would not be a close race I also believe that the Democrats

[00:54:13] had not nominated someone else this would not be a close race but I think it's just amazing to me having watched that debate where we're at and I think the rules I'm shocked that the Biden campaign in retrospect agreed to those rules because particularly the split screen

[00:54:35] and it was far too robotic and Trump lived to followed the rules and offered in many ways what I saw last night was also very interesting I wanted to say one last thing that's not someone that I think ever has I think a moment

[00:54:53] of silence I think he is someone who thinks that his voice is always needed and he doesn't have much of an inner monologue there were many times last night in the debate where I could see that Biden or that Trump was like

[00:55:07] it appeared to me, I've never met the man but it appeared to me that he was making a calculation in his head like saying I don't have to say anything he should just speak and speaking and Biden was continuing to offer these answers

[00:55:21] because of the format of the debate I think Trump would have interjected more and there would have been crosstalk that would have drowned out what Biden was doing and I think last night because of the rules and how the debate were structured it gave a clear unvarnished look

[00:55:39] at Biden's performance and his level that he's performing at and his competency level right now and I think that people who thought that those rules were in place only to protect Trump actually what they did is they exposed Biden and I think that was a miscalculation I completely

[00:56:03] agreed of course because I'm aner and I took notes during the debate last night and in the first 5 minutes I said that I wrote Biden's little voice lacks force and I was like, I'm still and now we know that's the spin they're trying to make

[00:56:17] it really like you said that the split screen did almost as much damage to me as Biden's actual verbiage and what he said because it was stark he looked a little lost he looked a little confused open mouth breathing it just seemed the 3 years age gap there

[00:56:37] widened to 20 in my book it just it was night and day 55 year olds or 280 year olds they can be completely different and their energy and vigor and how they present themselves but it was really stark especially with all of those concerns coming into this about Biden's performance

[00:56:53] we talked a little bit about how if we got the state of the union Biden it would be night and day different and I think it is that is even a stark contrast because it proves the point of does Biden only is he only able to perform

[00:57:07] with a teleprompter in front of him because in this with the trail off and it was really frustrating and sad almost it felt a little sad to watch and like cringe worthy it was wow but I want to pull out two tweets one that you

[00:57:23] head on about Trump just standing back and letting Biden dig his own grave ooh not pun intended that felt weird after that Dave Portnoy of Barstool tweeted Trump should just see it all of his time to Biden that's as strong a selling point

[00:57:37] because when Biden starts a sentence that he can't finish he loses his train of thought I love that I also really I'm not one who tends to agree with Ohan Omar maybe ever but she tweeted if I was Biden I would start every

[00:57:51] sentence with the fact that Trump is someone convicted of lying and fraud and no American should believe a word he says and I do feel like there that was a little bit missed opportunity and if Biden was able to articulate that again and again he might have had

[00:58:05] some more seizing of opportunities there I know we're probably going to chat about this a little bit more next week so I'm going to keep some of my comments hold them on to that one thing I did want to throw out and maybe I should have let the

[00:58:17] our two guests go at it a little bit more but there's this again this fanta fascinating report by MBC news that I'm going to share and it broke down a lot of different things one thing that it did break it down was the amount of attacks each man

[00:58:29] made to each other and the percentage of their answers off topic you had to guess do you think who do you think had more attacks that they slung instinctively I think Trump did perfect okay you are right 106 attacks by Trump 72 Biden

[00:58:45] surprisingly I thought this one would maybe be a little flipped 50% Trump was off topic 50% of the time and Biden was off topic 30% of the time so just a couple things I wanted to share there I want to just chat a little bit about

[00:58:57] what you've seen in the last 12 ish hours and what I've seen it or not it's me starting here I've seen a little surprised with the amount of Democrats I have seen Democrats and journalists impundence acknowledging the major issue that last night portrayed and what the path forward is

[00:59:15] and all of the jokes of folks reading the DNC rules but I guarantee there is a decent amount of folks who are scouring through the DNC rules and constitution bylaws and everything of what if anything could happen I don't know that there is anything that can happen

[00:59:31] at this point the amount of bound votes versus not bound votes I think is probably going to be tough there is certainly a lot of concern this was a week off that Biden basically had a week off at Camp David to prepare

[00:59:43] and this is what we got and he is still the leader of the free world he is still the executive and commander in chief and that's very concerning but I have been surprised that so many Democrats have been acknowledging that and verbal

[00:59:55] and vocal about that what is your thought in what we have seen from Democrats impundence since the debate I was surprised at how instantaneous it was I was watching it in real time and I thought it was pretty bad and I think my tweets reflect

[01:00:11] my tweets reflect in real time what I was thinking and what I was seeing on the debate stage on TV I think immediately afterwards I think there were two reactions first of all I think that the Biden campaign was slow to respond to what was going on stage

[01:00:27] and first of all let me go back to this for a second they knew how his voice sounded before he went on stage I don't know why they didn't set expectations that he had a cold now I don't to me it sounded like he had a cold

[01:00:41] I don't know if he had a cold or I'm not a doctor to me he sounded like he had a raspy voice that may have come from debate prep but he didn't seem well he didn't seem healthy and he seemed like

[01:00:53] he was cold or other type of stuff and so I'll buy the excuse that he had a cold but if he had a cold why didn't they articulate it sooner to at least prepare people for their voice because there was a shock value there was a shock value

[01:01:05] that I had when he started speaking and how he was coming across so there's that also I would say is that the Biden campaign I think then did a bad job because some journalists have noted and media people have noted and commentators have noted

[01:01:19] that they reached out to the White House and there was a gap of some time during the debate and then suddenly there was a fury of responses to me it seemed like people were trying to get on the same page

[01:01:31] they were using that time to figure out what excuse that they could come up with or what they could do because if it was a cold they just should have set a cold so they can set expectations on things that's a challenge to me

[01:01:41] I also think the Biden campaign did a poor job during the debate aside from answering the question on the health of what the response was going to be after this debate was over with because if there is a we've talked about the pre-debate spin

[01:01:55] we talked about the post-debate to spin but the debate spin I think to me the lack of a lack of spin that was done during the debate makes me think that it was an all hands on deck collapse mid-debate that it was not on so many levels

[01:02:13] everyone was just focused on what was going on if I was with the Biden campaign I would have considered I would have been walking around if I was in that studio I would have stuck a fork in an outlet to try to stop the stream

[01:02:25] I would have kicked a cable out of the wall I would have done something maybe even pulled the fire alarm just to try to end that debate in some way because it was that bad it was that bad of a debate and a couple

[01:02:39] just a quick story I'll share my first campaign I worked on was the 96 race and one of the things that I had to be tasked with was one of the first press jobs I had I did a lot of jobs in that campaign

[01:02:49] but one of the press jobs I had was doing some logistics for the campaign announcement and I remember being told you can rent the room, you can do all that stuff get all this stuff handled but ultimately it comes down to how the candidate performs

[01:03:01] and Biden on stage and that's I think every staffer's kind of nightmare is you can do all the debate prep but if your candidate goes up there and bombs or does things that's really out of your control and that stuff was out of their control

[01:03:15] but they also knew about it in some ways I don't think he didn't just he wasn't shielded off, he was with people and so I also what I'm I think that the there's two issues I think that the that Americans should be thinking about right now

[01:03:29] maybe three but we'll start with two and the first two are about Biden number one what is going on inside the White House what is the competency level of the day-to-day operations of the White House political awareness came in the summer I think of 86 or 87

[01:03:45] when the Iran Contra hearings were going on I remember listening to them in the car listening with my father and I really got involved in politics and following politics at that young of age one of the things that was kind of the subplots of the Iran Contra scandal

[01:04:01] was what did Reagan know and what was his competency level when that was going on and there was this soft kind of forgetfulness that Reagan had in 87 and 88 and I think some people would later believe that he had some early onset Alzheimer's at that point

[01:04:19] I was dealing with some stuff but I have to tell you something Reagan in his worst day when he was president wasn't anything like what I saw on stage last night related to Joe Biden and so as someone who wants America to succeed

[01:04:35] as someone who wants to see the president even if I disagree with him because America succeeds I'm very concerned about who's at the hand of God, who's managing the government right now because our adversaries saw that, world leaders saw that performance last night on stage and America

[01:04:53] wasn't strong last night and the what's very unique about our country is that reside the power of the presidency resides in the occupant of it and at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue and right now I have a lot of concerns as to what's going on day

[01:05:11] to day inside the White House independent of the campaign secondly the campaign I think is going to have some problems here logistically Becky and I would love I think we can break this down more next week but logistically it's a problem as you articulated there's committed delegates

[01:05:27] our listeners should dispel the myth that there's going to that in order for Joe Biden to not be the nominee Joe Biden would have to step aside there's no process right now that allows for new delegates to be elected or anything to be done

[01:05:41] they're legally bound to Biden and so absent Biden stepping away there's no procedure by which he can do that the rules are set up in both parties that way at this point neither Trump nor Biden can effectively not be the nominee of the parties because

[01:05:55] of the way the rules are set up and so they have to be invited into the decision making process to have that done I think there's a lot of concerns right now with the Biden campaign about how they stabilize this and what they do

[01:06:09] and I don't know what to say other than I just felt bad it was just a sad experience and I think I'm so appreciative of our space that we can talk about this because we have been respectful of discussing age and discussing the age

[01:06:23] of both candidates but I just don't feel confident and as I articulated last night on social media I voted for Trump in 1620 or 24 because I think he's unfit I now sadly think that Joe Biden is unfit for different reasons and I want to just say

[01:06:39] something and I hope it's not too hard but damn it where is the Biden family where is the Biden family right now in looking at what was on stage last night and that person I think about what they could be doing to be helping

[01:06:55] their, the member of their family because I refuse to be gaslight and if I could also just pivot on that for a second what boiled my blood probably the most last night was not was the reaction from the vice president Kamala Harris went on stage with Anderson Cooper

[01:07:13] and in essence tried to gaslight and say what we saw on stage didn't happen and there's anything that boils my blood is someone trying to gaslight me and say that's not what you saw I know damn what I saw on TV last night I saw a senior citizen

[01:07:27] who is in charge of our government not show a good sense of that he was aware of what was going on aware of facts and didn't show I think a strong level of awareness and competency about the job that he was doing

[01:07:45] I would not have a lot of confidence and so I can't imagine where Joe Biden will be four years from now when if he's re-elected and nearing the end of his term I just don't understand how he can do the job

[01:07:59] someone needs to explain to me how he can do the job and it's not I don't want to hear that he can do the job he only has to do the job better than Donald Trump I don't want to hear that

[01:08:11] that may be what I have to hear but I'm not ready to hear that right now but I thought the vice president did a bad job in terms of because there was a level of gaslight I have to tell you Darwin will take this as a compliment

[01:08:21] Darwin was more honest on our podcast than the vice president was last night and I'm going to give that guy props for just coming on and saying what happened and then acknowledging it because I'll have Darwin on every day of the week

[01:08:35] and I'll feel that he's being honest with was honest with us and honest with our listeners what the vice president did last night was not honest and really frustrated me it really I want to yes just chat a little bit about some of those points you made

[01:08:47] because I think for me watching that and since then my major thought is I've always thought that there have been Biden with his shortcoming and questionable competency at least had strong people around him and people around him that were going to be doing the hard work

[01:09:05] I now question all of those people around him the people in the White House and the people on the Biden campaign because there is no place for me to believe that in the last week and in the last month that Joe Biden let's

[01:09:25] there's just no way to say that he was last night out of 50% because he had a cold but in the last week at camp Biden or camp David he was a Sierra above it just there's no way that it's he fell so far

[01:09:41] from what he was at camp David and what he has been the last week we know they've known they have been gaslighting they thought that a miracle would happen this is like malpractice at this point how are there not people around him that are videotaping him

[01:09:57] and showing him this and saying sir you need to drop out months ago it's just this isn't something that happened overnight Biden at this point that we saw last night after a week of preparation after a week of of preparation

[01:10:15] and a week of rest and a week of napping whatever it might be he should have been on his A game and it is really concerning to me that the collection of people around him even let this get to this point and proceed and it really

[01:10:31] makes me questionable what is going up at the White House and do we get a second debate does he make it to November I really have true real concerns this is not about democrat or republican this is not about the issues at all I have really big concerns

[01:10:47] that there are folks that Dr. Jill and his family and his biggest strongest advisors have allowed it to get to this point because it is clearly not it's just not good like you said our friends, our allies but our opponents of countries all around the world

[01:11:03] are seeing this and watching this and thinking these are who I'm going to make deals with these are who I'm going to negotiate for billions of dollars these are who I'm working with for aid and peace deals or whatever military assistance we're giving it is

[01:11:17] it really hurts my heart for President Biden whether it's him that's not willing to acknowledge it or people not willing to say it to him but man retire I'm not saying this so President Trump goes in I don't even know if I'm going to vote for President Trump

[01:11:31] but it is just really troubling to me of what goes on at a day to day and how this man is the leader of our nation I would agree with everything you said and one point I made to you is that I believe

[01:11:43] and just I'll ask this to you again I believe that if the Republicans have nominated someone else, Nikki Haley for example I don't think this race will be close I think if the Democrats were to bring someone else forward I don't think this race would be close

[01:11:55] and so as someone who isn't going to vote for Trump I'm not going to vote for Biden but I think that Trump's the danger for Republicans is if they go out and pound too much on Biden being there that Biden he eventually leaves I just can't

[01:12:17] I need to hear something else other than it's the rules it's a convention rules and FEC rules as to why why there can't be this pivot because I just I don't want to be gaslit about it I saw last night on stage

[01:12:35] I think what we all saw last night on stage is it raises questions about the competency and the health and strength of Biden where that leaves us is this during the debate I thought to myself I don't think there's going to be a second debate

[01:12:49] I've now come to the position that if Biden stays in the race he's going to need another debate and he's going to need another debate and I don't know why if I was a Trump campaign I would accept another debate but there has been an agreement

[01:13:03] I did learn that there had been an agreement about I think a debate in September but I don't know if it happens I can see Trump saying why would I do it I could see Biden's campaign not wanting to do it

[01:13:15] but I think if you're the Biden campaign I think you're leaving today saying to yourselves we need to do a reset we need to do something to reset and the problem is I don't know if their candidate can do a better job today than he did last night

[01:13:29] but the question is why did last night happen if he can go out today so if Biden goes out today and goes surfing if Biden goes out today and does something, does some feet of strength to show that he's there why didn't that happen last night

[01:13:43] and that's the problem is that we were all watching last night America was watching and what we saw last night is what we saw and I think that we have to mainstream discussions about competency because last night as I was watching the debate, I did feel sad

[01:13:59] I did feel bad but I also was, I was upset I got more upset when the vice president started speaking but again to all those people who questioned whether this was going on or not it's true now I think that there's been a lot of issues

[01:14:15] I think that there's been some partisan gamesmanship that exist in normal campaigns and you can't see my hands I'm always doing this like the magician there's always some partisan games that are going on videos editing and stuff like that and Democrats have recoiled at that

[01:14:29] and what I think is happening now particularly with pundits journalists pundits and columnists across the country is they're saying you guys were conning us because what we saw happening was actually happening and someone said this to me earlier today that there's been this spin that behind closed doors

[01:14:51] Biden is doing advanced calculus and he's doing again maybe feats of strength I don't believe that's happening Becky and the space that we've carved out as a homeless Republican and a quasi or a Republican who's undecided that you are now we want America to succeed and I don't

[01:15:09] see if Biden wins how he's competent to lead and that's what's so sad Yes, I very much agree it's sad, it's frustrating that the Democrats are probably very grateful that their convention is in August versus Republicans that's just in about three weeks away

[01:15:29] so Democrats do have about six weeks to get their shit together but I think it's also the last things I want to say on this is I am very I'm going to be very interested to see how this plays out down ballot because

[01:15:41] we have discussed a lot and you had on this earlier but a lot of conversations about Trump down ballot I didn't even really didn't enter my mind of Biden's impact down ballot just because he was such a strong, steadfast Democrat Isn't that amazing

[01:15:57] But now we saw this like I mentioned with that Senate Republican ad every Democrat think of being a Democrat and having to now of course you're going to vote for President Biden you have to say that but now how you have to back up

[01:16:11] it's one thing with Donald Trump and you can say that's his personality but issue X, Y, Z Now with President Biden it's so much about do you believe that this is a competent human being because you saying that to your voters it certainly makes me question

[01:16:29] your decision making and your how you choose to do what you do and it really would as an undecided voter give me pause voting for somebody who over the last few months has been Biden and now continues to be for the next couple of months

[01:16:47] so I think I am very interested to see how the Democrats, the Senate Democrats House Democrats and down ballot state legislative how they if they distance themselves if they just focus more try to go more issue how they do that

[01:16:59] because I feel like it takes a little wind out of their sales of just being anti-Trump now you have to be anti-Trump and pro Biden and I just didn't see that being an issue before. I know we're going to chat a little bit more next week

[01:17:09] with on this and how it impacts maybe down ballot and the race ahead and actual voters but wow I think we could probably talk about this for hours on end. It was fascinating and a worst and best way possible and I am very excited to just see

[01:17:25] the next 72 hours play out. Yeah, I think we're going to have a lot to talk about next week and we discussed how fair doing and I think we'll do another episode next week on this subject with some other folks talking about it in more kind of unvarnished ways

[01:17:39] but I just will say just my last words Dean Phillips was right and I think that there as just a subject I want to bring up next week I'll just tease it a little bit. All of the Democrats particularly some of those in Minnesota

[01:17:51] who were so hard on Dean Phillips you have some agonizing your face because there's a lot of things that he said that he was not just right 100% right and Dean Phillips is going to turn out to be more right than I think people wanted to believe

[01:18:09] and I hope a lot of people are reviewing what he said and I'm curious if we I'm watching for the introduction of Dean Phillips into the next into the political discussion more substantively in the next few hours

[01:18:24] we're going to have a lot to talk about next week. Becky, thank you for leading this discussion again today your debate prep was wonderful and I also will say to you thank you for the pre our discussion earlier this week because you went through the debate

[01:18:36] I was more prepared to watch it and our discussion was just spot on but just thank you for leading that and doing all what you're doing. It was a great show, thank you to our guests we'll be back next week. Sounds good

[01:18:48] We want to thank you for listening to this bonus episode of the Breakdown with Broadcom and Becky before we go show some love for your favorite podcast by leaving us a review on Apple Podcasts or the platform where you listen you can also leave us a review

[01:19:04] or give us a shout out on our website or across all social media platforms at atbbbreakpot The Breakdown with Broadcom and Becky will return next week. Thank you for listening